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Cartoon Physics #2- Eddie's horse


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#1 RS3D

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Posted 20 November 2017 - 11:31 AM

This is my second attempt at doing one of these types of animations.  The first one got so corrupted I gave up.

 

In this one, there will be 4 scenes:

1) Eddie rides horse in a open elevated / mountain area.

see horse5a for a very rough preliminary animation.

Attached File  horse5a.mov   396.95KB   60 downloads

 

2) Eddie rides horse descending into a narrow rocky trail where he should slow down.

 

3) Of course, he will not slow down and shoots off the trail which triggers a cartoon-type response by

the horse to get back on the trail and avoid disaster.

see horse6 for a very rough preliminary animation.

 

4) A final humorous scene, where the angry horse bucks Eddie off his back and kicks sand in his face, etc

 

I hope I can get some feedback for the following:

Is the horse gallop in horse5 animation believable?

Does the scene in horse6 animation convey the dangerous situation and allow for playing with the horse gallop

action to become a 'road runner' or other cartoon character's type actions to get back on the trail? Would a

different angle be better?

 

 

 

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#2 Rodney

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Posted 20 November 2017 - 11:26 PM

I hope I can get some feedback for the following:

Is the horse gallop in horse5 animation believable?

 

Yes, most definitely!

I think I'd add just a little secondary action on the part of the boy riding the horse to sell the effect of the horse's movement.

It wouldn't have to be much.  Just enough to convey that the boy is reacting to the movement of the horse.

Note that this is basically the principle of squash and stretch but it's enough for the bones of the boy to simply react.

 

I like!

 

Does the scene in horse6 animation convey the dangerous situation and allow for playing with the horse gallop

action to become a 'road runner' or other cartoon character's type actions to get back on the trail? Would a

different angle be better?

 

Yes, looks dangerous!

At first I was thinking that a lower angle looking upward might be better but in thinking more... no... I don't think so.

It has been said before that humorous scene setups often work best  if squared off (or horizontal) with the camera so you've found a good angle for that.

Perhaps best of all you've left plenty of space for the horse to pause and react to the situation.

I"m tempted to suggest a little camera movement (similar to your other video "horse5") so that the delay will be further emphasized.

The camera could be pulled in closer at the beginning and zoom out even as the horse is galloping off the cliff.

The camera then begins to track/follow the horse again after the horse has changed direction and motivates back toward the path.

 

Fun stuff.

More please!  :)


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#3 steve392

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Posted 21 November 2017 - 12:42 AM

I agree the guy on the horse needs to move a little but looking good


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#4 RS3D

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Posted 22 November 2017 - 01:28 PM

Thanks to Rodney and steve392 for your input.

 

Attached is an update for the the 3rd scene on the cliff.  I hope this gives a little better idea of what I want to

accomplish.  There will be a lot of work to go through all the alignments of Eddie, the horse's reins and

the horse, and secondary animations for Eddie's hat and body positions.  If anyone sees opportunities for

improvement, please let me know.

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#5 RS3D

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Posted 28 November 2017 - 12:55 PM

Attached is another update to the project.  This one is a roughed in animation of scene #4 where the angry horse throws Eddie off his back

after the close call in scene #3.  The white puffy spots are markers for action objects showing where dirt will be kicked up by the horse's

hooves in the final animation.

Attached Files



#6 robcat2075

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Posted 28 November 2017 - 02:08 PM

Attached is another update to the project.  This one is a roughed in animation of scene #4 where the angry horse throws Eddie off his back

after the close call in scene #3.  The white puffy spots are markers for action objects showing where dirt will be kicked up by the horse's

hooves in the final animation.

 

Here are some of my thoughts..

 

The general gallop loop looks promising but there's a hiccup in it.

 

Any dust kicked up by the horse would be left behind, not continue forward.

 

 

The cowboy looks like he's floating over the horse rather than riding on it.  That is a tough thing to make work. :o

 

A horse skidding to a halt would crouch lower and have the feet farther forward in front of his weight. Think of a "stubborn" mule resisting getting led somewhere.

 

the cowboy flung off the horse will pretty much follow a smooth arc until he lands. He will not halt in mid air and then fall vertically.


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#7 RS3D

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Posted 06 December 2017 - 01:28 PM

To Robcat2075, thanks for the excellent suggestions.  As usual, you have identified the things that need to be done to raise this scene to the next level.  Hopefully I can complete them all in my lifetime.

 

I have been most concerned about scene #3 because the extreme action poses are what will make this into a cartoon action sequence.  Attached is an update to scene 3 with some changes to  smooth out

the actions.  I also added some sound effects to ramp up the actions.  I am going to have to look into a sound editing program in order to make these effects work correctly.  Can anyone recommend a 

sound editing program?  Once again, like in scene 4, the white puffs are just action object place holders, in this case they will probably be rocks falling off the side of the cliff as I get closer to the final rendering stage.

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#8 RS3D

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Posted 03 January 2018 - 09:49 AM

Here is an update to Scene4.  I changed the viewing angle to better match Scene3, I added some sound effects and refined the animation a little bit, but

it still needs work.

 

It is still a process of roughing things in, but I now have a pretty good list of things to do (thanks to people who have made suggestions)  to put the whole thing together.

 

I located some good mountainous images on the internet that hopefully will give the various scenes a consistent look and I am still looking

for a sound editor that will be necessary toward the end of the project.

 

I'm always grateful for any input people may have about the current status of the project.

 

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#9 robcat2075

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Posted 03 January 2018 - 10:21 AM

It's basically a problem of momentum.

 

The rider doesn't stop because the horse has stopped.

 

The rider keeps moving after the horse stops and only stops because he falls and hits the ground.

 

FallingOffHorse.png

 

 

 


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#10 RS3D

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Posted 08 January 2018 - 12:33 PM

Thanks again for the input Robcat.  At this point, I am more interested in getting the camera shots and scene layouts consistent than in refining the animation.

There are two reasons why I want to delay the final animation adjustments until the very end.  First, I seem to have a lot of problems with adjusting

animations and characters in the choreography windows, where it is sometimes difficult to know where stray erroneous key frames have been built while testing

alternatives.  Once I am done making changes in everything else, I will try to finalize the actions.

 

The second reason for delay is that I am trying to explore "cartoon physics" not necessarily scientific physics.  If I am trying to get the viewer to accept

the unrealistic actions in scene 3, I would like to try to get as humorous as possible in scene 4 and go for more unrealistic actions to follow scene 3.

 

Attached is another update combining current state of scene 3 and scene 4.  I still have work to do for consistency on the sound effects, backgrounds and lighting, but

I hope it shows progress.

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#11 RS3D

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Posted 03 February 2018 - 06:03 PM

I refined scene 1 and added scene 2 and combined these in the attached file.  I added a horse gallop sound effect and happy background music.

I think I will need a scene 2a to help set up the sharp turn action in scene 3.  I am still not refining any actions just yet, just getting all the pieces in place.

 

I downloaded the free Audacity sound editor.  It looks to be pretty sophisticated, so I will have to spend some time learning it.

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#12 RS3D

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Posted 08 February 2018 - 12:56 PM

I completed all the preliminary work on the backgrounds, sound effects, camera angles, textures and basic layouts for scenes 1, 2, 2a, 3 and 4.

See attached file for the .mov.  I will probably add a scene 5, where  the horse leaves Eddie in the dirt and gallops off into the distance.

 

If anyone sees anything weird about anything related to the backgrounds, etc. so far, please let me know.

 

Once It looks like everything is ok, I will start tweaking or redoing the individual scene's character actions and action objects to include some of the suggestions people have previously made.

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#13 Rodney

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Posted 08 February 2018 - 03:35 PM

I think you've probably accomplished what you set out to do for his one.

 

 

If anyone sees anything weird about anything related to the backgrounds, etc. so far, please let me know.

 

Does the guy at the bottom of the screen sitting there without a shirt in the second shot count?  ;)

(I assume that must be your cameo in the film)

 

My only suggestion would be to add some post effecting to make the style look like black and white (or sepia?) to give a sense of old timey film or western flavor.

I've got something of an example rendering now.


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#14 RS3D

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Posted 13 February 2018 - 08:43 AM

Thanks again for the suggestions Rodney.

 

It is not me in the picture. I lost the name of the person who posted the mountain pictures on the internet, so I left the person's image on the background until I am done making changes.

 

In your previous suggestion you said:

                    The camera could be pulled in closer at the beginning and zoom out even as the horse is galloping off the cliff.

 

I am thinking of trying a cut away during the middle of the scene3 where the horse and Eddie fly off the cliff.  It would be very brief and just focus on Eddie dangling from the horse's reins as seen from above and show a look of terror on his face. This is the kind of thing people would associate with cartoons. This will be tricky to do while maintaining the sound effects, but it may (or may not)  add to the effect of the action.



#15 RS3D

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Posted 02 March 2018 - 02:20 PM

I did a VERY rough action cutaway of Eddie dangling from the horse's reins.  I do not know if it adds anything to the project or not.  In any case, I do not want to spend a lot of time on it if it won't be used.

Does anyone have any opinions?

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#16 robcat2075

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Posted 02 March 2018 - 04:34 PM

I did a VERY rough action cutaway of Eddie dangling from the horse's reins.  I do not know if it adds anything to the project or not.  In any case, I do not want to spend a lot of time on it if it won't be used.

Does anyone have any opinions?

 

I think that helps add some panic to the scene :)


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#17 RS3D

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Posted 10 April 2018 - 08:41 AM

I made another update to the project.  I added a scene following the opening to show that Eddie and the horse were increasing in elevation in order to help set up more danger for scene 3, which has the disaster action.  This added scene was tricky to do, but I will be faced with the same problems in the final scene, where the horse rides off into the distance after dumping Eddie to the ground.

 

The problem is in trying to do 3d actions against a 2d decal background.  I do not model the whole background scene, but try to use animation tricks to make it seem semi-realistic. To show that Eddie and the horse are moving away from the camera, I continuously decrease the scale for both models and set up an envelope in the sound editor to decrease the amplitude of the gallop sound in proportion to the scale changes. 

 

I use a path constraint to tie the models to a path in the choreography. The problem is that as the scale decreases, the stride length of the galloping action also decreases, which means that the horse's apparent speed increases and throws off both the sound of the gallop and the overall impression that the horse is running at the same speed during the length of the scene. So I also set up animation of the path ease channel to offset the negative effects of the size scale changes and hopefully the whole thing still looks somewhat smooth.

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#18 Rodney

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Posted 10 April 2018 - 09:10 AM

I like that Devil's point sequence... I must assume this is the scene you refer to as being added as I don't recall seeing it before.

Looks perilous!  So, I'd say in adding that scene you've accomplished your goal.

 

It sounds like you've been jumping through a lot of hoops to achieve these results and your hard work is paying off.

 

 

(If you want me to photoshop that guy out of that 3rd scene I'd be glad to do it.

He's giving me the creeps.  hehe  That or you could just put a nice deserty bush or rock there.)

 

Added:  Something like the attached.  

If you look closely you can still see him hiding there.   ;)

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  • plate003.png

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