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LordPython
So I've been away from A:M for a few years and I have the itch to get back into it. So I dug out my A:M 10.5 CD and installed it (I don't have the money to upgrade). It's coming back quickly to me. I am trying to model my coffee table right now, but I'm stuck. Plus I don't think the way I did it was the best way. Here is a pic of my coffee table (please forgive the mess). As you might be able to see, it has rounded edges and corners and there is an indentation with a gold band that goes all the way around.

The way I did it was I drew the outline of the profile of the table (Table1.jpg). I then extruded that and stretched it to make a square (Table2.jpg). I then copied and rotated what I had to make the other two sides. Now the problem I'm having is the corners where the legs go. I'm not exactly sure how to model them to match the curve of the table top and the indentation.

Like I said I'm sure there's a better way to do it, perhaps a way to make the entire table top as once piece, then just attach easily modeled legs.
John Bigboote
It looks like you need to play 'connect the dots' on the corners... and see where that gets you.

I have that exact same 'Timex' digital alarm clock, I see under your table...funny! How is your leg doing?
LordPython
QUOTE(John Bigboote @ Feb 11 2012, 08:00 PM) *
It looks like you need to play 'connect the dots' on the corners... and see where that gets you.

I have that exact same 'Timex' digital alarm clock, I see under your table...funny! How is your leg doing?


He he, actually the crutches are my girlfriend's, she had surgery a few weeks ago.

But thanks, I'll try adding some splines.
LordPython
QUOTE(LordPython @ Feb 11 2012, 08:11 PM) *
QUOTE(John Bigboote @ Feb 11 2012, 08:00 PM) *
It looks like you need to play 'connect the dots' on the corners... and see where that gets you.

I have that exact same 'Timex' digital alarm clock, I see under your table...funny! How is your leg doing?


He he, actually the crutches are my girlfriend's, she had surgery a few weeks ago.

But thanks, I'll try adding some splines.



Ok, well, actually adding the splines seems to be working well, however I have two issues. First off, I made sure that all of my patches (except one) were nice 4 point patches. I added horizontal splines connecting all of the left points to the right points and added a point in the middle. I then went down and connected all of the middle points with a single spline. Even though I did this, I still have some empty patches. I'm guessing this was because when I added the center splines, I messed up and had to detach them and just filled in where I needed them.

My second issue is that, at the very top I have a hole seeing as there's only 3 points. Any ideas for that?
robcat2075
This technique may be useful to you...

modeling a beveled N-gon
LordPython
QUOTE(robcat2075 @ Feb 11 2012, 09:30 PM) *
This technique may be useful to you...

modeling a beveled N-gon


Ya, I've thought about trying a bevel, but because of the detailed design, I don't know how that would work.
largento
QUOTE(LordPython @ Feb 11 2012, 08:15 PM) *
My second issue is that, at the very top I have a hole seeing as there's only 3 points. Any ideas for that?



Join the two crossing splines. That's why there's a hole.
LordPython
QUOTE(largento @ Feb 11 2012, 09:57 PM) *
QUOTE(LordPython @ Feb 11 2012, 08:15 PM) *
My second issue is that, at the very top I have a hole seeing as there's only 3 points. Any ideas for that?



Join the two crossing splines. That's why there's a hole.


But wouldn't that disrupt the patches that those splines are a part of? I can give it a go, but I figured if I added another point to them, then my table wouldn't have a top.
Rodney
As Mark suggested if you just join the splines at the top the hole will be filled in.
I don't see that as an optimal solution however. Some form of bevel would be better.

There are a lot of ways you can approach a corner.

Attached is an image that show four ways to use three point patches to get it done.
The example on the upper right could be extended in a way to avoid all three point patches by adding another CP as the spline rounds the corner.
The upper left might work best for a more organic shape.
The lower left for more control over the shape of the beveled edges. (This is just like your example but with more splines. If you connect your top splines it should look a lot like this one)
The three pointers extending across the top surface and the middle spline connecting at the back in the way it does (lower right corner example) make that one the least desirable solution but in some cases it will also work.

There are many more variations but these are a few to get the ideas flowing.

As far as your other image goes (the one where you say you were careful to create four point patches) you've got invalid patches there.
Look closer at the number of Control Points and where they are in relationship to one another. I'd say you probably just need to attach the CPs together to make then renderable patches.
mouseman
Here's how I solved that problem on a dresser model:

Click to view attachment

There is only one 3-point patch, all others are 4-point. I think this comes closes to Rodney's bottom left example.
LordPython
Ok, well I started over and cleaned up the CPs a bit so that the holes in the corner are no longer an issue. I also joined the splines at the top of the corner to make a 3 point patch to close the hole. However, this has started 2 other problems. The first is, as you can see, the curve at the bottom is going down instead of out. This kind of confuses me because all of the other splines have had no issues. I tried using the bias handles, but that just made a sort of J shape.

The other issue is that after joining the splines on the top (to make the 3 point patch on each corner) it somehow killed the patch on the main section, even though there is a 4 point patch. So I'm somewhat confused.
robcat2075
QUOTE(LordPython @ Feb 17 2012, 10:14 AM) *
Ok, well I started over and cleaned up the CPs a bit so that the holes in the corner are no longer an issue. I also joined the splines at the top of the corner to make a 3 point patch to close the hole. However, this has started 2 other problems. The first is, as you can see, the curve at the bottom is going down instead of out. This kind of confuses me because all of the other splines have had no issues. I tried using the bias handles, but that just made a sort of J shape.

The other issue is that after joining the splines on the top (to make the 3 point patch on each corner) it somehow killed the patch on the main section, even though there is a 4 point patch. So I'm somewhat confused.


these are both spline continuity problems. If you can post that I'll show you why it is that way and how to fix it.

LordPython
QUOTE(robcat2075 @ Feb 17 2012, 11:44 AM) *
QUOTE(LordPython @ Feb 17 2012, 10:14 AM) *
Ok, well I started over and cleaned up the CPs a bit so that the holes in the corner are no longer an issue. I also joined the splines at the top of the corner to make a 3 point patch to close the hole. However, this has started 2 other problems. The first is, as you can see, the curve at the bottom is going down instead of out. This kind of confuses me because all of the other splines have had no issues. I tried using the bias handles, but that just made a sort of J shape.

The other issue is that after joining the splines on the top (to make the 3 point patch on each corner) it somehow killed the patch on the main section, even though there is a 4 point patch. So I'm somewhat confused.


these are both spline continuity problems. If you can post that I'll show you why it is that way and how to fix it.



Sorry, what are you asking for? Do you want me to post screen caps of just the splines? or is there something specific I need from within A:M that I need to post?
robcat2075
the model.
LordPython
Ahhhhh, yes ok. There you go
robcat2075
It turns out both problems are the same problem...

Click to view attachment

Connecting Corner Splines

Spline Continuity
LordPython
QUOTE(robcat2075 @ Feb 17 2012, 07:11 PM) *
It turns out both problems are the same problem...

Click to view attachment

Connecting Corner Splines



OMG! Robcat, that was an amazing tutorial, that was much more than I could have asked for thank you so much. I really do appreciate how you explained everything rather than just telling me how to fix it. Thank you again.

Also, if you don't mind me asking, what program did you use to record it? That may come in handy for future questions I have so I can show how I've done stuff.
robcat2075
QUOTE(LordPython @ Feb 17 2012, 10:23 PM) *
Also, if you don't mind me asking, what program did you use to record it? That may come in handy for future questions I have so I can show how I've done stuff.


I've been recording with (free) Hypercam 2 and recompressing the raw file with Quicktime Pro.

Btw, I've begun revising TAoA:M and have all of one lesson in rough form. You are probably beyond its level but you may find it useful none-the-less.
LordPython
QUOTE(robcat2075 @ Feb 18 2012, 12:04 AM) *
QUOTE(LordPython @ Feb 17 2012, 10:23 PM) *
Also, if you don't mind me asking, what program did you use to record it? That may come in handy for future questions I have so I can show how I've done stuff.


I've been recording with (free) Hypercam 2 and recompressing the raw file with Quicktime Pro.

Btw, I've begun revising TAoA:M and have all of one lesson in rough form. You are probably beyond its level but you may find it useful none-the-less.



Thanks, I'll check it out, it can't hurt to go over the basics again. BTW, I finished the table. I made a glass to put on top so you can see the reflectivity.

Thanks again
Vertexspline
Outstanding little video Robert-------- very nice job explaining some more continuity spline issues that seem so baffling for us less experienced. This made things so much clearer . Thanks again.
Rodney
I just got a chance to see Robert's video.

Not only is it a great explanation of spline continuity (very important) iIt's also a great example of what posting part or all of a model can reveal when someone can look at it up close and personal. From the images alone I wouldn't have guessed that the continuity of the spline wrapped all the way around the table like it did.

Excellent demonstration Robert!
robcat2075
I actually had that happen to me before. I was resplining a face and had broken and reconnected so many splines that i ended up with an empty four-point space in the cheek that sure looked like it should be a patch and I couldn't figure out why it wasn't.

D'oh!
Fuchur
QUOTE(robcat2075 @ Feb 19 2012, 09:58 PM) *
I actually had that happen to me before. I was resplining a face and had broken and reconnected so many splines that i ended up with an empty four-point space in the cheek that sure looked like it should be a patch and I couldn't figure out why it wasn't.

D'oh!


This maybe helpful too:
Basic Modelling Tutorial with A:M v17

Or the old splinemanship-tutorials:
Tinman's Splinemanship-Tutorials

See you
*Fuchur*
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