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Hash, Inc. Forums > Featured > Feature Films: Tin Woodman of Oz - Scarecrow of Oz > Scarecrow of Oz
HomeSlice
THE LIST (please add to the list as you find things that must be fixed)
You may access and edit the list as a Google Docs spreadsheet through the link below.
http://spreadsheets.google.com/ccc?key=0As...uthkey=CIPEhYML

If you enter an issue and you do not give your name under "Reported By", the issues will most likely be deleted. wink.gif
KenH
Cool idea! I like it. Robert, now's the time to get those suggestions in.
robcat2075
How do you watch it?
HomeSlice
QUOTE(robcat2075 @ Jul 21 2010, 07:10 PM) *
How do you watch it?

http://www.holmesbryant.com/files/video/scarecrow_of_oz/
MJL
Mega Kudo's to all ninja.gif who have brought S.O. to this point!!!
HomeSlice
Hey Ken, would you please commit the changes you made to the scenes in 1_01? Thanks.
KenH
OK. Done now. On to the next one.
robcat2075
All the shots I've looked at say "Draft". What is done in them and fit for commenting on and what elements are not?
KenH
They're what we've got so far so they're drafts until we/you tweak them. However, check your changes with the spreadsheet (link at the top) as it may have been done already.

mouseman
Here's an attempted fix for Bumpy Man "SC arm going through BM hand several times".
HomeSlice
QUOTE(mouseman @ Aug 15 2010, 08:54 PM) *
Here's an attempted fix for Bumpy Man "SC arm going through BM hand several times".

Thanks Chris, I'll take a look.
robcat2075
I've been meaning to make some comments but have always been busy with some other endeavor. Is it too late?

i looked at teh spreadsheet but I'm not sure how to identify specific shots or if that's even done with that?

Here's one pose that really is crying out to be fixed, however.

Click to view attachment

HomeSlice
Tweaking has been finished for quite some time. I am in the re-rendering phase and rebuilding the edit as chunks of new renders complete. Anything before Act 2, Sequence 9 (Pessim) is in the can unless you want to do something in Post.
robcat2075
Did the clouds in the Throne room scene get fixed?
HomeSlice
QUOTE(robcat2075 @ Nov 1 2010, 02:59 PM) *
Did the clouds in the Throne room scene get fixed?

Apparently you are the only one it bothered because no one entered it in the spreadsheet. The spreadsheet was open to anyone who wanted to help.
robcat2075
I was never sure what level to make comments on.

But it's lots easier to fix the movie before you put it out than after.
mouseman
There was some talk of KenH tweaking a few things for SO, though I don't know if that has started or even is going to go through. If there are going to be any additions, here is one thing that stood out for me ... Trot's run cycle. She looked a little bobble-headed, as if her head was going to shake off while running. Also, her stride looked like it was intended for a much longer stride length. I tried to keep as close as possible to the existing cycle while toning down only the parts that had problems; the hope was to minimize any problems with transitions that might currently exist, but any new problem introduced might not be noticed until it's been rendered.

See the attached movie showing the difference in the run cycle (sorry, AVI only since Win64 can't render directly to MOV and I don't have easy-to-use conversion software right now). I've also attached the new cycle which could be renamed and used to replace the existing cycle, or just added to projects and then replace the short cut with this one.

The run cycle is used in:
Act II\Seq01-Ork\SC04\2_01_04b.cho
Act II\Seq04-Waterfall\Sc04\2_04_04.cho
Act II\Seq07-Balloons\Sc01\2_07_01.cho
Act II\Seq07-Balloons\Sc02\2_07_02.cho
Act II\Seq07-Balloons\Sc02\2_07_02a.cho
Act II\Seq07-Balloons\Sc03\2_07_03.cho
Act II\Seq 14-Love_Potion\Sc01\2_14_01.cho
Act III\Seq03-Departures\Sc02\3_03_02.cho
jakerupert
May I ask, what the status of SO is at the moment?

Is it on hold, abandoned or nearly finished, may be?
HomeSlice
QUOTE
May I ask, what the status of SO is at the moment?
Is it on hold, abandoned or nearly finished, may be?

SO is finished. The people who spent the most time working on it have been given links to an SD version to download and watch. I was waiting to see if anyone had any desire to submit it to any local film festivals in their area. A common requirement for submission to film festivals is that the film must not have been made previously available for the public to view.

But it has been several weeks and not a single person has expressed any desire to try to submit the film to any local festivals, so I may just post a link to it somewhere. Just waiting to make absolutely sure, because once it becomes public, that will severely limit its potential to get accepted into even small local festivals.
mouseman
Edmonton International Film Festival: None of the categories fit. They either need to be under 20 minutes (Narrative Short, Documentary Short, Animated Short, Family/Children Short) or Narrative Feature (over 70 minutes) or Documentary Feature or Edge of Night (only shown late hours).

Global Visions: No info on their site regarding 2011.

Edmonton Jewish Film Festival: wrong genre.

Dreamspeakers Film Festival: wrong genre (must be aboriginal).

100dollar film festival: Super 8 and 16mm only.

Reel Femme: Focuses on female directors.

I think that's a NO for Edmonton, unless perhaps Global Visions resurrects itself.
robcat2075
Did I get a link to the finished version?
HomeSlice
QUOTE
Edmonton International Film Festival: None of the categories fit. They either need to be under 20 minutes (Narrative Short, Documentary Short, Animated Short, Family/Children Short) or Narrative Feature (over 70 minutes) or Documentary Feature or Edge of Night (only shown late hours).


SO is a Narrative Feature. Go ahead and submit it. If you need a DVD, I'll send you one. If they reject it because it is 62 minutes instead of 70 minutes, then that is their loss wink.gif It might even work for the "edge of night" category ....
HomeSlice
QUOTE
Did I get a link to the finished version?

Checking .... yes you did smile.gif

I'll send it again.
NancyGormezano
I just noticed this web site (2 minutes ago) - European Childrens Film Association - it seems to list film festivals..uh...aimed at children...in..uh...Europe... Might warrant some looking at ?

I noticed it when looking at www.anifestrozafa.com - a film festival in Albania. It is not clear if the films are ONLY by children or students...they also say for children.
robcat2075
The biggest impediment to entering film festivals is the entry fees. $20 is not an outrageous amount but if you enter 10 like that it adds up.

Most want quite a bit more, so you need to start weighing possibility of being accepted (always very low) and the merit of the festival itself versus that cost.

I do recommend you at least enter SO in one of the IMDb qualifying festivals (see withoutabox.com for that) so you can get an IMDb listing for SO and all its contributors which is a nice thing to have.

The best festivals of course are, of course, famous, well-attended ones but those are the hardest to get into. Next best are ones that one of the contributors can get to in person.
mouseman
QUOTE(HomeSlice @ May 3 2011, 12:01 PM) *
SO is a Narrative Feature. Go ahead and submit it. If you need a DVD, I'll send you one. If they reject it because it is 62 minutes instead of 70 minutes, then that is their loss wink.gif It might even work for the "edge of night" category ....

I can try on the Narrative Feature (that will have to wait until Thursday night). The "edge of night" would only be shown late at night, and thus we would not get our primary audience (kids/families).
jakerupert
>If they reject it because it is 62 minutes instead of 70 minutes

<Or just make the credits 8 minutes long!
mouseman
I have sent off an email to EIFF asking them if we could submit anyways.

In the meantime, I am working on creating a "Project" for Scarecrow of Oz on WithoutABox. It looks like this aspect might be quite important to get right. I get the impression that input from more people than just me might be of benefit.

Who did the WithoutABox project for TWO? (Jason?) I'm not far enough into the interface to know for sure whether I can link in other people to be able to edit the entry, but I think that would be a good thing to do if it is possible. Here is the "view" link, although I don't know if it's public.

There are a few other questions, if anyone can chime in, I'd appreciate it. Here they are:

Can someone (Holmes?) send me a document with the credits? It would be nice to be able to use that as a checklist so I am sure I get everyone listed correctly.
  • Entering all of the credits is a bit fragmented in the interface. I'm not 100% sure they'll have all of the right titles available. I don't think there is a distinction between "Modeling", "Texturing", "Rigging", and "Animating". Do they all go under "Animating"?
  • Any idea how to enter in multiple roles for a person? e.g. Ken Heslip is Bumpy Man, Cap'n Bill, and Grasshopper. I tried separating with a comma.
  • Steve392 for Laughfish ... I'm not sure how/if I should enter his name for this role.
Countries
There is a section where you can select which country production or filming was done in. Since the render farm is in the US, probably specifying that as the only location for filming is appropriate. For production, should we mention every location that we had people working on the film? If so, these are the ones I could think of (I listed them with at least one name of someone that worked on SO from that location).

USA (Hashes, Holmes, Robert, Nancy, etc.)
Canada (Me for my small part, maybe/probably others)
Brazil (Xtaz)
Ireland (Ken)
Norway (Stian)
Germany (Sebastian)
U.K. (Paul Forwood)

What are the other countries?
robcat2075
QUOTE(mouseman @ May 8 2011, 08:34 PM) *
Who did the WithoutABox project for TWO? (Jason?)


I did.
QUOTE
[*]Entering all of the credits is a bit fragmented in the interface. I'm not 100% sure they'll have all of the right titles available. I don't think there is a distinction between "Modeling", "Texturing", "Rigging", and "Animating". Do they all go under "Animating"?


I found this awkward. When I was entering TWO credits a lot of relevant job titles that I see in other animated moves didnt' appear until long after I had entered everythying, so many people have very general or only slightly descriptive credits for TWO.

QUOTE
[*]Any idea how to enter in multiple roles for a person? e.g. Ken Heslip is Bumpy Man, Cap'n Bill, and Grasshopper. I tried separating with a comma.
It's possible. I forget. Perhaps it's done by defining a character.

QUOTE
[*]Steve392 for Laughfish ... I'm not sure how/if I should enter his name for this role.
Contact him and get his full name

QUOTE
There is a section where you can select which country production or filming was done in. Since the render farm is in the US, probably specifying that as the only location for filming is appropriate. For production, should we mention every location that we had people working on the film? If so, these are the ones I could think of (I listed them with at least one name of someone that worked on SO from that location).
List all the countries where people did something ("Production")

QUOTE
USA (Hashes, Holmes, Robert, Nancy, etc.)
Canada (Me for my small part, maybe/probably others)
Brazil (Xtaz)
Ireland (Ken)
Norway (Stian)
Germany (Sebastian)
U.K. (Paul Forwood)


Just about all of these should already have an IMDb profile as a result of TWO, btw



HomeSlice
Here is an OpenOffice spreadsheet for the credits. Also there is a pdf file with a very granular description of who did what.
HomeSlice
Countries involved were:
USA
Canada
Australia
Ireland
Brazil
Germany
mouseman
Hi, folks,

Sorry for the delay, it's been a busy week. Here's the status of the WithoutABox project submission.

1. Roles

Roles that translated well:
Production Coordinator
Producer
Author of Adapted Material
Editing -> Editor
Screenplay -> Writer

Roles that I think are probably okay:
Lighting -> Cinematographer/DP
Effects -> Special Effects
Network and Render Farm Support -> Technical Advisor

Roles I haven't entered yet:
Render Wranglers - should these be "Technical Advisor" as well?
Modeling, Texturing, Rigging, Animation, Layout - would these all go to Animator?

Missing Role:

Director - We have noone listed as Director, and I'm guessing this is important to have a name attached to this role. I'm guessing the best person to list would be Holmes, or should there be multiple?

2. People without existing IMDB pages.

Presumably, once it gets submitted to IMDB (an option in WithoutABox), they will be created based on the data I have entered.

Chris Dailey
Eve Schafer
Heather Hash
Myron LeRoy
Nathan Madsen
Steven Farmer
Haven Hash
Robert Kelly
Sebastian Pfiefer
Steve392 (Still don't have his real name.)

3. They ask for synopses of varying lengths. I gladly welcome some copy for each of these (including something to replace my original LogLine).

LogLine - 125 words. Here's what I wrote off-the-cuff:
Trot and Cap'n Bill run into difficulties traveling to Jinxland. They eventually run into Scarecrow, who guides them along the way. The three of them run into Pom, a gardener who is in love with the Princess of Jinxland. Together they try to foil a plot by King Krewl to make Princess Gloria marry Googly Goo, while Tin Woodman rushes to catch up with Scarecrow and save them all from the witch.
Medium - 250 words

Long - 1000 words

4. Here's a summary of other fields I've entered for your information and amusement and correction and feedback. There are a few questions in there, as well.

Date of completion: April 2011
Running Time: 1hr 3min 39sec
Does the project have distribution or sales representation? No. Should we designate someone? Jason?
Language: English
Translations/Dubbing: None
Niche: Children, Youth/Teen; Student Project = no
Genre: Adventure, Family; Others: Children Animation, Independent, Road Trip
Funding budget: $0 Source of funds: Volunteer
Format: Color, 1.78 (16x9); Stereo sound
Filmed in: Media Files: OTHER - Digital
Exhibition: DVD Region 0 NTSC; Media Files: .MOV (Quicktime); Sound=OTHER Is there a better choice for sound? Options include Digital Dolby EX, SepMag/Cardband, Dolby SR, Dolby Digital, Dolby A, DTS, SDDS, Dolby E, Optical.
Format - Screeners: DVD Region 0 NTSC; Media Files: .MOV (Quicktime)
Print Shipper (Contacts for exhibition copies of the project): Holmes Bryant Should this be someone else?
Publicity Web Site: none Is there some place we'd want to send people to?
Publicity Trailer: none Is there going to be a trailer made?
Publicity Consent (Do you consent to press screenings and/or television broadcasts of excerpts of the project for publicity purposes?): No. Should this be yes?
Presskit (Formats and types of press materials available to support pre-screening and exhibition): Withoutabox Filmpromotion Kit (Free for all projects!) Other options are Digital and Paper.
Publicity People: Manager=Holmes Bryant Should this be someone else? Additionally, other possible available roles are Agent and Publicist.
Countries: The ones I listed earlier. Holmes didn't include Norway in his list -- I assume leave it in for Stian.

5. Edmonton International Film Festival replied: "We only accept feature films (70+ minutes), or short films (under 20 minutes) - we don't have a 'mid-length' category (ie: '62 minutes')."
robcat2075
QUOTE(mouseman @ May 15 2011, 02:20 PM) *
Roles that I think are probably okay:
Lighting -> Cinematographer/DP
Effects -> Special Effects
Network and Render Farm Support -> Technical Advisor

Roles I haven't entered yet:
Render Wranglers - should these be "Technical Advisor" as well?
Modeling, Texturing, Rigging, Animation, Layout - would these all go to Animator?


I ended calling many of those "art Department" but...

I'd be inclined to send a note to IMDb support and ask why certain titles listed for most animated films are not available for selection.





QUOTE
2. People without existing IMDB pages.

Presumably, once it gets submitted to IMDB (an option in WithoutABox), they will be created based on the data I have entered.

Chris Dailey
Eve Schafer
Heather Hash
Myron LeRoy
Nathan Madsen
Steven Farmer
Haven Hash
Robert Kelly
Sebastian Pfiefer
Steve392 (Still don't have his real name.)


I'm sure some of those were in TWO

QUOTE
3. They ask for synopses of varying lengths. I gladly welcome some copy for each of these (including something to replace my original LogLine).


QUOTE
LogLine - 125 words.


One day in the Land of Oz, Cap'n Bill enlists the aid of the Scarecrow to help him take young Trot to her new home in Jinxland, but they find Jinxland has been taken over by an evil king.


(one tantalizing, seductive sentence if possible)



QUOTE
[/indent]Medium - 250 words


Perhaps your original

QUOTE
Long - 1000 words


not essential






mouseman
Many thanks for the feedback!

QUOTE(robcat2075 @ May 15 2011, 02:57 PM) *
QUOTE(mouseman @ May 15 2011, 02:20 PM) *
Modeling, Texturing, Rigging, Animation, Layout - would these all go to Animator?
I ended calling many of those "art Department" but...

I'd be inclined to send a note to IMDb support and ask why certain titles listed for most animated films are not available for selection.
Looking at the TWO page on IMDB, it looks like they were credited as "animator" but are sorted in an "Animation Department". I'm guessing selecting "animator" for their role would put them in that department.

I think you are right, sending a note off to their support would be smart. I'll do that shortly.

QUOTE
QUOTE
2. People without existing IMDB pages.
Heather Hash
Robert Kelly
I'm sure some of those were in TWO
I'm still not seeing Heather Hash on the TWO page on IMDB. I do see a Robert Kelley (notice "-ey" on the end of the last name) ... is it the same person?

QUOTE
QUOTE
LogLine - 125 words.
One day in the Land of Oz, Cap'n Bill enlists the aid of the Scarecrow to help him take young Trot to her new home in Jinxland, but they find Jinxland has been taken over by an evil king.
(one tantalizing, seductive sentence if possible)
"Good title." (Shakespeare In Love)

QUOTE
QUOTE
Long - 1000 words
not essential
I made it the same as the medium synopsis, just in case.


One thing I just thought of ... would "Layout" be covered by "Set Designer"?
robcat2075
QUOTE(mouseman @ May 15 2011, 04:45 PM) *
One thing I just thought of ... would "Layout" be covered by "Set Designer"?


Not so much for us. Our Layout is more like camera angle and placement.
HomeSlice
QUOTE
One thing I just thought of ... would "Layout" be covered by "Set Designer"?

QUOTE
Not so much for us. Our Layout is more like camera angle and placement.


From what I've read, which may or may not be accurate ...
"The layout artist has a lot to do with the lighting of the film, the scope, the way the camera moves through the sets," he explains. "The layout artist is in a very great way the cinematographer of an animated film, deciding what the camera is going to see and where the characters will be blocked in a scene."

So I figure a Layout Artist does Lighting, Camera and Character Placement/Blocking.
mouseman
Withoutabox responded saying:
The credit you are looking to add does not exist in the Withoutabox project form. The project form should be considered as your festival application form. Festival applications to not require this credit to be submitted.
I think the best thing to do might just be to add everyone in the roles of Modeler, Texturer, Rigger, and Layout as Animator, and when I go to add it to IMDB, hope there is an interface for changing credits.
Edit: Or leave them out in the Withoutabox submission and add them in IMDB.
HomeSlice
Sounds good to me. I have so little knowledge of all that, I don't even have an opinion really. unsure.gif
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