A friend of mine asked me if I would meet with Mr. Charles Kiegle concerning funding his research into the origins of the universe…

No one else was interested so I ended up going by myself. The presentation was well prepared, with an overhead projector, dry/erase board, reference materials & videotapes. Plus, Mr. Kiegle had a personal charm that captured my attention; but he wasn't exaggerating when he suggested I block out several hours in my appointment book.

What I heard was a fundamental paradigm difference in how the universe was formed - I mean a whole new theory! In Mr. Kiegle’s version of creation, all matter did not appear instantly in the "Big Bang," relegating the universe to the poverty of no more matter unless it is converted from energy, (m = e/c2). Instead, Mr. Kiegle insists matter is created each time there is a “rotational vector polarity change.” Not only does this theory stun the physics intelligencia, but all science is affected: from paleontology, because if matter can be created spontaneously then all the methods of dating events in the far past are based on a moving starting point; to geology, because as matter was added to the earth's core, it’s diameter increased, and that’s what broke apart the continents. This is not some lame, piece-wise, exception-prone guess like Einstein's gravitational theory glued together with quantum mechanics. Rotational Potentials span all aspects of creation: from the very small, like molecular nucleuses, to the very large flights of galaxies!

To say I was dumbfounded would be an understatement. What had started out as a courteous lark had turned into me questioning three hundred years of established scientific dogma - I was truly impressed and titillated!

And what is the workable manifestation of this phenomena on earth? How can we create sustainable cold fusion in a package the size of a football? How will all of the world's energy needs be met now and into the future?

Ball lightning…

To be honest, Mr. Kiegle does not claim to have ever witnessed ball lightning, but he has ample evidence to prove its existence. According to him, as much as six percent of the population has reported seeing ball lightning in their lifetime, and their complied testimonies is a substantial body. Should you ever witness ball lightning, or better yet, should you get photographic proof of a close encounter, please upload your images & video to YouTube, (where great science is being proven everyday!)

Neal Adams has been evangelizing the expansion of the earth's crust to explain the continents for years now. He has some very compelling videos on his website.

Not sure I would buy into spontaneous matter generation, but Neal's theories certainly make more sense than all the continents having been plopped together as Pangea and floating apart and assembling themselves across the planet.

Leave it to you Martin to have me googling 'ball lightning'.

Elements of this remind me of Neal Adams' theories (we discussed these briefly here in the forum years ago... I think).
Especially this part:

QUOTE

as matter was added to the earth's core, it's diameter increased, and that's what broke apart the continents.

Neal Adams of course being of Batman and X-MEN fame from Marvel and DC comics.

http://www.nealadams.com/nmu.html

There are probably some pretty stark differences between Neal Adam's and Charles Kiegle but my brain made the leap between the two.

At any rate... the mind boggles.


Edit: It appears Mark knows his comic book creators too.

My mind is completely blown.....I just watched the Neal Adams videos. Now I want to look up Kiegle...Samuel Carey....but I'm a little afraid I have to say(!!!)

I haven't slept all night and now this. The 'Rare Earth' theory which says SETI isn't finding anything because there's nothing out there (yikes) claims the circumstances needed for complex life on Earth are so rare that its unlikely it happened anywhere else... no such circumstance being that six billion years ago (give or take a billion) another planet was in the same orbit as Earth and Earth crashed into it causing the Earth to be larger then it should be... would take a piece of that. Well I have searches to do... after some sleep. Oh, do we still have matter/antimatter pairs surviving near an event horizon explaining why the universe is expanding at an accelerating rate? Any impact on dark matter/energy?

Later,
Rusty

While his theory sounds promising, and I'm sure you've given his math a once-over, I can't help thinking that if he got this far, he would have had some scrap published in Nature, or at the very least WIRED or Discovery.
I can find ZERO information on a Charles Kiegle. What is his address? What schools did he attend? Where did he work?
Does he have ANYTHING that has been peer reviewed?
The guy is practically invisible, I can't even find his critics.

My tinfoil hat picks up alien communications AND blocks the CIA surveillance bugs hidden in my water pipes.

p.s. I keep "Ball Lightening" in my pants where it belongs.

-vern

My tinfoil hat keeps my brain fresh-smelling.

Since he says it works on all levels, he ought to be able to work up a small scale demonstration where he creates some matter.

If I were potential investor I would expect at least that and I'd want to know that other people had been able to reproduce it.

And if only 6% of the population has seen ball lightning I'd say that's a bad candidate for solving our power problem. A third of the population has seen an angel. Angels sound much more powerful than ball lightning; we should harness them instead.

I saw two angels playing tennis with ball lightening on the head of a pin.

-vern

it would be interesting to talk to some of those people who have "seen" angels. prolly good for a laugh.

I know someone who swears she has seen an angel, and goes on and on about the beautiful white wings. Even after I've told her that the whole "wings" concept was the invention of renaissance artists, a symbolic device to represent their ability to move at will.

A doctor of optometry once told me,"Eyes do not tell people what they see, people tell eyes what to look for." Numerous studies and experiments relating to the human's cogitative abilities seem to support this statement. So it really is not very far fetched for two people to be observing the same scene and one person sees Ball Lightning and another sees an angel with large white wings. Yet another may see absolutely nothing. An instrument may only register a slight variation of naturally occurring electromagnetic radiation. As far as I'm concerned, all of these are "right".

If you are stuck in only one possible reality, you have a miserably limited existence.

Imagination is indeed a wonderful thing... The world would be a sorry place without masterbation.

The Old Testament describes angels ("seraphim" and "cherubim") as having wings, so the notion does predate renaissance artists. However, it says Seraphim have six wings. Probably rigged with TSM2.




Ask your friend to count the wings next time.

A moose once bit my sister.

Hmm, ball lightning..............that could've been one of johnl3d's experiments gone wild. In theory of course.

The nerd in me says: "rotational vector polarity changes" take place whenever a mechanical watch's flywheel changes direction. The coil spring provides the basis for the rotational potential of the flywheel, storing energy in the deformation and force of the coil spring (potential), which is periodically released as it accelerates the flywheel in the opposite direction (reversing the rotational vector polarity) until the flywheel passes the neutral position of the spring (zero spring force) and then starts decelerating as the coil spring absorbs the flywheels momentum (kinetic energy) converting it back into (rotational) potential energy stored by the spring.

This sort of thing happens in fluid mechanics too, though it is usually more complicated and much harder to calculate mathematically.

Is this what Mr. Kiegle is saying is creating matter? If matter is created so easily, wouldn't that lead pretty quickly to catastrophic violations of the conservation of matter and energy? Wouldn't stars accelerate in their growth as they get larger, until they grew large enough to collapse into black holes. Stars have massive amounts of "rotational vector polarity changes" that take place in the fluid mechanics of their mix of hot gasses and plasmas and "astronomically" intense and violently circulating energy and matter fields.

He should be able to make specific predictions that could be experimentally tested to either confirm or refute it. That's the part that makes a scientific theory "scientific".

There are some pretty imaginative "theories" out there that look "scentific", but aren't really. They can be pretty seductive, just like a lot of the "conspiracy" theories.



By the way, it looks like a French mathematician, Alain Connes, has very likely figured out how to unify gravity and quantum mechanics--and without all those nasty "exception prone guesses". Unlike the thirty years or so we've had of "string theory" without much progress toward experimentally verifyable predictions, it looks like his approach is likely to produce predictions that can be tested. One interesting result of his work is that it naturally avoids the "singularities" of other theories when describing black holes. It leads more directly to the same results as earlier work that unified all the forces other than gravity (the "Standard Model"), only in his case he has added gravity to the mix. Others studying his work have shown that it also eliminates the "cosmological constant" that bothered Einstein so much.

Time will tell!



Is it not likely that as conscious beings living in both an inner world of thought, memory, imagination, and emotion, and an external world that is immensely huge and complex, that we often confuse the two? Aren't we prone to ascribing so much "reality" to our imagination, that it can blot out the reality that actually surrounds us? I think we also confuse "perpective" (a particular view) with reality, which extends well beyond what we personally perceive. I prefer to think of reality as transcending my ability to apprehend it. I can see, touch, smell, taste, hear, and sometimes understand a part of it, but I can also confuse it with my inner world of imagination and not really perceive it clearly. If, for instance, you want me to understand something about yourself that I did not know, I would never reach that understanding if I did not transcend my own imagination and focus on apprehending the facts you are trying to communicate to me--things that go beyond my imagination. I have to discipline my imagination to serve as a tool to help me understand you more accurately.

Sorry! Just a preachy way to suggest a paraphrase: "If you are stuck in only on possible perspective, you have a miserably limited existance."

On a lighter note:

Anybody out there a fan of that wonderful perveyor of "misinfotainment", Dr. Science? Answering important questions like, "If sound doesn't travel in a vacuum, why are vacuum cleaners so noisy?", or "Why do you never see baby pidgeons?" or "Where does the other sock really go?"





A new question for Dr. Science: "If you can't tickle yourself, how is it possible to masterbate?"

Speaking of ball lightning, check this out:

Brazilian Ball Lightning

Catastrophe was averted when we switched to digital, quartz-regulated watches.

I like your perspective on that It highlights the age old question "just what *is* reality?" We could assume various intellectual and theological disciplines and debate that one until the cows come home, but still, I like the way you think.

"....even if you know everything the theory (of Quantum Mechanics) has to tell you about the particle, still you cannot predict with certainty the outcome of a simple experiment to measure its position - all quantum mechanics has to offer is statistical information about the possible results. This indeterminacy has been profoundly disturbing to physicists and philosophers alike, and it is natural to wonder whether it is a fact of nature, or defect in the theory."----David J. Griffiths, Introduction to Quantum Mechanics

After seeing that video, I have to agree with the ex-Prez Bush: "I always thought a brazilian was a bigger number than that".

He said that right before he faded into bolivian.

(groan)

Matter, does it matter?
The question always arises in the continuity of thought that precedes our answers. Consider this , did the chicken come first or the egg, Matter, our hen of the unverise was divine,creating the egg from which all life sprang or was it the egg that sprang from the bowel of nothingness to spread out the fires of the univerise so to arrive at the very question that is ask, Matter, does it matter?

Science, the essence of truth but devoid of life, a waster of mankind, brutal, unforgiving, mastering all but none to be mastered by.

Man, Challenging, Clinging, fearfull, brave, heartless but full of soul, can the two live together, science and man?

Had to throw some philosophy into the mix.........

That's right, I hadn't thought of that! Since the world has gone digital, the rotations have been replaced by binary "ups and downs". Must be that "up" quarks and "down" quarks counteract excessive "rotational vector polarity changes". Sort of like Morgan's Paradox, the complimentary principle that keeps the universe from failing altogether: "If Murphy's Law can go wrong, it will."

And Vern keeps the "ball lightning" in his pants where it belongs...

It really hurts but someone has to do it.

When mankind is mature enough to safely harness this power I will reveal it. Until then I must keep it in my pants, hold it back until the last possible moment.

To achieve this... I think about baseball.



-vern

Hey now... don't be giving Martin any comedy material.
Do you really want to encourage such behavior!??

I've been chuckling a lot as I've been reading the forum lately so apparently my funny bone isn't completely broke.

A Brazillian is less than a Gazallion. Which is why Bush had so much trouble negotiating peace in the middle east.

-vern

AHA! My art teacher was wrong! I'd rub his nose in this if he wasn't croaked.

Why does that look so phoney to me... is it faked? I really thought I would see a hi-tech laboratory as I opened this vid...funny to see the brazilian dirty feet and floor... why does the 'ball' stop when it hits the chairs shadow?

If this is what we are pinning our hopes for the future on...we are in trouble.

Is that anything like Morton's Toe?

Click to view attachment

And it could explain this:

Martin---thats gross!

another link from that page: www.chukanovenergy.com these wing-ding scientists need to take a class in web design...

Good GOD! What was that huge gigantic... image thingy... slowing down the page? Are you kidding me? And why was a photo of miss Utah on that page? Did she help type up his scientific papers? Does she have something to do with great balls of lightening?

Anyway, I love this statement:



... and fight the fierce laws of physics. We all know how difficult and expensive it is to lobby the government to change the laws.


-vern

Check out "Quantum Macro Effect #3". I guess it only works on "2D quantum cows". If you are going to process a "3D non-quantum cow" better not forget that bowl or you could have a real mess!

2D quantum cow vs 3D non-quantum cow...


Oh...and in "Quantum Effect #4: Quantum Excitement" the "quantum cow" looks like what you would get if you zap the "regular none-quantum cow" enough times.

Should we perhaps call the Chik-Fil-A cows about this guy?

New this season!: "Laws of Physics Court TV" and "Judge Judy Does Physics"

Wait a minute...fighting the laws of physics...already done that!: "Jackass".

If the Earth's diameter changes, this would change the dynamics of the moon's effect on ocean tides (Samuel Carey's theory was expansion without a change in mass) even if the Moon's orbit did not change (assuming the Earth's mass stayed the same). So this got me wondering how you would determine tides millions of years ago. Fossil records! Sure enough there is an article listed as a reference on the Wikipedia for Expanding Earth theories that covers this very topic:

Precambrian Tides

Basic conclusions were that the diameter and mass of the Earth has not changed measureably in the last 620 Million years, and the Moon's rate of recession (enlargment of it's orbit over time due to its interaction with the Earth's oceans) has stayed amazingly constant over the same period of time.

Amazing what information you can actually get from fossil records!