Doese anyone have an idea how to find the problem with the waiting,this is what I get when I click the mirror bones ,any help would be exstreamly welcome ,as its so near yet so far

Hey Steve392,

have you looked in the mbw_conflicts.txt file that is referred to in the error message? It may point you (or someone) in the sirection of the problem.

Regards
Glenn

Thank's for replying ,I can't find that file anywhere Don't kno where to look ,any one know

Steve, the first thing I notice is that the "MirrorBones" bone in not at 0 on the X axis. Did you translate the "Root" bone in the X axis by accident? I see duplicate spine bones that were created by the MirrorBone plugin. The black cps are probably because those cps are not mirrored (CFA). The plugin will assign them to the model bone, causing the false weighting. If you have a version saved before running the plugin, I can take a look if you want.

I would apreciate you taking a look Mark ,there is no waiting on this version as yet ,I asighned the cp's and saved it ,I don't think I touched the root bone but it might have happend and I didn't notice

Steve, I looked at your model. There are some modeling issues that you should take care of before you do any rigging. I would recommend deleting the left half of the model, fixing what needs fixing and then do a Copy, Flip, Attach. The clothes and hair doesn't matter, just the body.

The Root bone had also been translated in the X axis, this minor offset is causing the back bones to be duplicated. The back2_geom bone has some Y rotation as well.

Thank's a lot Mark I will do that ,shame it was goin so well I was prety pleased with how easy it was lol

Post a new thread in the wip section or in a thread you may have started already and I'll try to help you with it. It not that bad, but a CFA makes it alot easier. The head has the most problem areas, so if you plan on animating the face, your best bet is to fix it. So post some wireframes.

Thats very nice of you Mark I know your busy
I cfa it and can't see what's needed in the modeling so your advice would be appreciated

I was hoping you would fix things before you CFAed. Which model did you CFA? The model you posted I hope.

For starters, in the crotch area there are 2 issues the need to be fixed before the CFA.

Got that fixed Mark ,I can allways cfa again when its fixed up

I'd be a bit concerned on how the hands will animate. I would move and add a few splines for each finger.

The face has a number of things that need work. The first problem area is the intersections located in the red circles. We'll try to get rid of them by redirecting and adding a few splines. The first thing I would do is add at least one more spline ring around the eye socket.

This is how I done it ,what do you think ,I can't seem to make a 5 pointer at the nose for some reason maybe it will be ok later

Looking much better. There are a few more things, but I can't show you til later.

Thank's Mark where getting there

Here's the next thing. I would shift a few spline and redirect some. There is a spline that ends in a hook in the lip, to me serves no purpose, get rid of it. My edit doesn't show it too well, but you want the splines smooth flowing with nice curves to them. The splines going into the lower eyelid want to be equally spaced (roughly), the same goes for the upper eyelid. Once you get this done, there is one more thing. I'm not going to worry about the top of the head and ears, since they are covered by the hair geometry.

By the way Steve. Did you see my post on the fingers?

Click to view attachmentFor your perusal ,I got the 5 pointer at last ,there was an extra spline in the eye from the cfa I think ,anyway what do you think ,ready to cfa
I can't find your post on the fingers ,where is it? Allthough I thought the hand on this was working really well in the action when I was doing the wiating
edit got it howd I miss that,thank's Mark

The hands are the last post on page 2. Did you see my post for the redirection of splines on the face?

Did you post the right image in your last post?

Oh that bad hey ,yea that last one has the splines in the face and hooks in the mouth done ,or did you mean take them splines out alltogether? ,done the hands
yea see what you wanted now ,Im cracking up lol

The hands look better.

Give me front shaded/wireframe again of the face when you're done.

Hang in there Steve.

Oh Im a hanging ,Hows this looking Mark

Let's push these cps away from the lips a bit and add another spline ring between them and the lips.

Yea that makes a lota differance,I allso tried to define the nose a bit more without adding any cp's ,had some bad splines in the eye ,so deleated and redone them,its them dam bias handles I can never get them right

I would shift these cps around to reduce the size of that 5 pt patch.

For the most part, it's down to shifting cps around. There are still things that could have better spline layout, but this should animate fine.

Before you CFA, let's see a side view.

now this is the bit I didn't want you to see

The only thing I'm going to suggest is, to adjust the cps in this area. I would shape the cps in the eyelids to fit the eye better and adjust the cps in the brow area. I won't look at the rest.

Ok I done some work around the eye and found a bad spline again so got rid and redone it ,what you think

It's hard to tell from this angle.

If you're happy with it, then you can CFA.

ok ,it might take me a while Im not good at this

You can do this at any time. Once you CFA, the geometry will be mirrored, so you can adjust the cps on one side, with mirror mode turned ON, at any time. But you'll want to do it before you retexture and rig the face. (face rig not available yet, so you have time if you plan on installing it)

If you want to get on with installing the 2008 rig, we can do that. Post a wireframe, in bones mode, when you're ready. Assuming you modified the version of the model that had the rig in it, BEFORE you used the MirrorBones plugin.

oops no no bones in it as yet,I whent back a version ,so Ill put that in then show before wiating it,is that ok Mark,and hell yea I want the face rigg aswell

That's OK. Post an image when you're ready.

Got the rig in ,no wiating yet ,Im not sure about the wrist twist and fan bones ,wether to assian cp's to them or nor ,or are theye just used in the wiating .I would like you to check the model if thats ok

Ok, there are a few things that need fixing. Some of the bone placements are not in a good position. Since you already ran the "InstallRig" plugin, I need to put the INSTALL bones back in for you. I can't do it right now, I have to go out for a couple of hours. I'll post the model, with the INSTALL bones back in as soon as I can. I'll post some images too.

The issues are the shoulder joint, hip joint, shoulder base, ankle and the neck base. It could work as is, but not great. Also the fans in the leg do not orient correctly, they need all the rotate values to match.

I did a quick MirrorBones plugin to see what happens. There seems to still be issues. It appears the the CFA is not mirroring correctly and it doesn't assign all the cps. I'll look into that more.

Thank's Mark ,I noticed that the calf is not far enough down should have gone to the next spline ,and the end of the thumb is wrong but I think that might be I got the install bone rotation wrong for the thumbnail ,but can't correct it.The cfa left some hook splines wrong so I broke and fixed them ,could that be a problem

Sorry this took so long.

I redid the CFA, to see what was going on. There is a definate problem. It appears that any hooks near the center spline do not miror correctly. I fixed allthe hook problems and tried the MirrorBones plugin and it worked fine.

So now back to the rigging. I put the INSTALL bones back in for the leg, arm and balance. This should be all you need.

First thing, drag the neck base manually to the location in the image, it's too low where it is now.

Translate the Right Leg INSTALL bone, using the manipulator, to this location.

Using the rotate and scale manipulators on the Right Leg INSTALL bone so the ankle joint is located here.

You will need to redo the whole leg installation right down to the toes.

Make sure you follow the installation instructions.

I'll get to the arms tomorrow.

Thank's a lot Mark ,strange about the hooks ,maybe its something to avoid near the edges,prehaps 5 pointers are better in this situation

Warning -- Five pointers have to be re-marked as a 5-point patch after CFA *IF* they are along the center line. It's usually not that big of a deal, though.

I done what you said except the arms ,treid running the install rig but it didn't work for some reason ,but everything looks ok ,well to me anyway

Sorry Steve, I got caught up with other things. You didn't post a pic or a reply about finishing the legs, so I wasn't sure if you were still with me. Do you still have a version before you ran the InstallRig plugin? I'll post a pic for the arms if you do.

The InstallRig plugin just deletes the INSTALL bones, hides bone that aren't geometry bones, and unhides the geometry bones. It doesn't do anything special.

Hello Mark ,yea I still got the same model as we left it except I done the tweaks you said above I just tried it and it flips all the bones apart from toese ,end finger bones and all fan bones sorry the smaller zip file is no goodClick to view attachment

Here's your model with the arms fixed, bones mirrored and exported from an action. If you find any problems, let me know.

I'll have to look into the mirrorbones issue in v15, there may be a problem. I also found 2 corrupt constraints in the IK leg setup when I exported your model. I'll be posting a new installer soon with a fix.

Many thank's Mark ,look forward to the new installer ,it would be a rare thing if there were no teething probs
edit
this is working a treat now ,the hands are especially good to use .You done a real nice job Mark

There is some weighting to do, I didn't do any of that. You should still be able to weight just the right side and run the MirrorBones plugin again.

I have most of the wiating done now ,thank's .But I got a small problem that I didn't have before I stared wiating and snart skinning ,I have cheked the smart skinn by editing it and can't see any reason for it ,anyway heres the prob I open an action and just the lef leg is not ik(i HAVE THEM ON IN THE MODELS user properties ) so I switch it on in the pose slider menu and the knee turn controler is twisted the wrong way ,I turn it back and all is ok,untill I open a new action .I looked at the knee fan and leg bones in bones mode and theye have the roll handels pointing correctly ,some bones are blue in an action and some are white ,any idea what this is , its not a real big problem as I can just flip it around when I start a new action,but I would like to know how I messed up
first image shows blue bones second a new action without turning on ik to the left leg and third with ik on before turning the knee control . thank's Mark (IF )you have time