Here's my first keyframe/animation sequence. Not alot of animating but quite abit of constraining. This is where Bill and Trot are sucked down to the sea bed and go into the portal tunnel to Oz. It's 3.4mb as I turned on particles for the bubbles.

1_03_02

That's great Ken.

Budda-Bing!

(Ken, you're a stud.)

See if you can make that look like a water funnel.

Thanks guys. Yeah, I'm not sure how to do that. Should it be transparent? Or made up of "lines" whizzing by? Anyone any ideas?

Looks good Ken. Like your bubbles -

For water funnel - perhaps an animated material similar to the water used for the waterfall - but swirled around, and more turbulent - or perhaps even an animation projected onto the funnel model - as it changes shape some and rotates - and like you say lines, bubbles, whizzing more - I'm not sure what a whirlpool would look like underneath viewed from a distance, maybe lots of debris caught up? - murky blurry imagery

Maybe communicate the turbulence with lots of violent camera moves? and things quickly passing by the camera?

(just throwing out ideas - hoping to spark others)

EDIT: I wonder - maybe fluids can be used in some way? Newton in some way?

For visual reference:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-s65_6DTGZc

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B6K0UHeK3MU&NR=1

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0WrNrjRNJ5w...feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sZmzFC6ggLE...feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-9tIIUkn4ME...feature=related


Etcetera Ad Nausea

Ah...."causticy"! Good ideas and inspiration both! We'll see what comes out.

Phew! Materials are hard work....

Change parameter
Test render
Wait a while
Doesn't look right

Repeat ad nauseum.

Here's where I'm at. I'm sort of liking the vibe, but I think the loops need to be less repetitive and probably connected in a spiral. Maybe materials aren't the way. The blip at the bottom is connected to the light I think. I can't get rid of that.

Maybe an animated Cylindrical Map?

I'll try it, but I don't know if it'll turn out any better. I'll have figure out how to draw a spiral cylindrical map. Also, it'll need to be transparent.

Well, I think this looks abit better using images. The funnel is animated to turn so there'll be motion blur involved too.

here's perhaps the start of a funnel decaled, shape - it's boned, can swirl around, maybe even use dynamic constrait to whip it around - or be done by hand - and of course the obligatory BubbleLoons will be swirling around as well...

I'm working on a test animation - but have to go out for awhile

here's a test funnel animation - using dynamic constraints - obviously it could be made larger, different shape, and not use dynamic constraints.

This was test to see how the decal would hold up - so if you'd like the details and images to add to your model Ken - let me know

And of course it will look better with your bubbles and bubbleloons

Sure. Add into the whirlpool folder (in sets). I'll take a look and see what I can get from it. Thanks.

done - just uploaded images and model

Aaver did a tornado for TWO in the FX forum. I think he posted a project as well. I'm sure that could be modified to work. He had it rigged too, which worked quite well.

Here's the project. You probably don't need to do much of anything. The materials look pretty good for water too.

[EDIT] Is it just one scene? If it's more than 1, I can probably get the material to animate automaticly, so it doesn't need to be animated in the chor.

Thanks for finding that Mark. I should be able to get something out of all these. Yes, it's just the one sequence/chor.

OK. I think this is getting close.

Hmm...Nancy's concept seemed to be the best.

Ken I believe were getting pretty close!

Here's my first pass at animating this scene. This one is pretty fun. Comments and critiques are welcome. If you give thoughtful and intelligent comments, I will take the time to try to improve it.
... I'll do my best, anyway.

Once you add a bunch of swirling (vortex) bubbles to that, it will mask almost any animation weakness. (Though Trot & Bill to swim to that cave mighty quickly?)

Maybe if we had them put closer to cave and slowed down teh swimming it would be more ? realistic or believeable? Martins right they are swiming too fast but if you slow them down it looks it's not a possible swim? maybe not sure?

great i think the swirling could be faster and i agree about the swimming, seems a bit too fast....

Wow. I missed this sequence when it was first discussed.
Great insight into how an fx scene like this comes together.

If I may be slightly contrarian here I think the rate of swimming is just about perfect.
It might even be a little slow in places?

What is missing is a close up on Bill and/or Trot's face that signals to us their recognition of a chance to escape.
With that seen the pace of the swimming is right on the mark. They don't have that much air to breath... and they know it!

Go ahead... test it out... throw yourself in a swirling whirlpool and try to escape into a cave.
See how long it takes.
I'll um... I'll wait here.

Here's the latest. I turned particles on this time.

Yeowsers, that's cool. (Rodney's right - it does need a reaction shot.)

Wow. Cool is right.
Thats brilliant Holmes.

My brain said "Disney" when I saw the effects on this one.
(Thats a good thing)

If the camera zoomed in a little closer right before they took off swimming my earlier concern would be satisfied.

Also... hope I can articulate this properly...
I think at the very beginning the camera should (for a little while only) follow only one object. This would create just a little more horizontal motion and open up the environment as the camera moves left to right following the course of the whirlpool. In effect we the audience are caught in it right along with the characters. As we near the bottom (and the camera tracks downward the effect subsides and we are free enough from the whirlpool to think along with the characters.

Sorry... I know I haven't conveyed that right.

Wonderfully executed shot!



Edit: I know we are in Oz so the following may no more than a lark of unnecessary reality.
I offer it up anyway just in case it satisfies.

I am wondering what it would take me as Capn Bill or Trot to want to go into a cave versus swim back up to the top.
There are two things that spring immediately to mind.

- There is something about the cave that is inviting.
This could be something as simple as a little (green or bluish?) lighting shining weakly from the mouth of the cave.
Or signs that the cave is an old submerged entrance of some type. (Brick and mortar or some man made artifice)

- The water above is still swirling too much while the water at their level is calm.
Perhaps a small current of water is entering the cave that clues Capn Bill in that there is an opening inside.

Those are good points Rodney. I would love it if you would download the set and play with it a little. In the meantime, I'll try to remember to put a light in the cave entrance. That's the easiest/fastest solution

I'm not sure what you and Martin mean by a "reaction shot". Would you please explain a little more? I have Bill looking around, then he gets Trot's attention and points in the direction of the cave. Is it happening too fast?

OK, well I think I addressed all the issues in this update.

Perfecto!

Edit:
I think you've got it with this last render. It's a lot easier to read their thoughts and empathize with their situation with that close up.


This was written before I saw your last update:


More of a head and shoulders/close up on the two.
Its important that we be able to read their thoughts and that is hard to do if you can't see faces clearly.

QUOTE

I would love it if you would download the set and play with it a little.

This set? Or another set?
I'm not trying to interfere with what you've already got going.
I do keep SVN updated though.

I hope to clear off my schedule so I can devote full time to SO in the near future.
Making that happen has been a little more difficult than I thought it would be.

That's much better! way to go !

awesome... much better now!!! i really like the camera movements and angles... there´s only one thing left i could find that bothers me: the arm movements of the swimming are a little bit too fast IMO. maybe i´m just not the hell of a swimmer, but i can´t move my arms that fast under water.