Hash, Inc. Forums > Workshop Lighting

Hash, Inc. Forums > Featured > Feature Films: Tin Woodman of Oz - Scarecrow of Oz > Tin Woodman of Oz > TWO Lighting

agep

Feb 8 2007, 01:07 PM

NancyGormezano

Feb 8 2007, 01:24 PM

Stian - I think it's fabulous to see KuKlip's set rendered like this - all that wonderful modeling is just overwhelmingly terrific and really interesting.

There is only one thing that bothers me - and maybe it's not that important (as these are still images) - is where the earth/stone outcropping meets the brick wall - it has a very pasted on 2D look - the line is very straight, producing an illusion of no depth.

Perhaps the edges where they meet should be made a bit more irregular? or perhaps adding an edge with depth to the stone or the bricks - so that it looks more 3D, or just tweaking some cps to have more differences in depth.

Other than that - TERRRrrrrrIFIC

Paul Forwood

Feb 8 2007, 02:17 PM

Nice work, Stian!

I agree with Nancy about the area where the brick and stone meet though. There should be a line of mortar there where the brick layer has plastered cement onto the end of his bricks before placing them against the stone. You could try making 32 bit maps, for displacement and colour, of just the mortar line and decaling it on top of your brick tile decal. Other than that the only way that I can see of doing it is to model the line or cover it with something. Perhaps some pipes or cables or something else?

You've done an excellent job on this workshop but I am wondering about that cupboard on the wall. Isn't there another identical cupboard and bench upstairs? The one with TinHead in it? Having two almost identical locations will probably just confuse the audience. If it was my decision, which it is not, I would put another cupboard on both sides of this one or add something different to one of them.

Keep up your brilliant work!

Zaryin

Feb 8 2007, 02:26 PM

I love everything about this lighting, but I have to agree with the above comments. Maybe some decaled cracks or modeled bricks in that area...?

agep

Feb 8 2007, 03:14 PM

Thanks for your comments. Yeah, your right about the brick->stone problem, it has been a neglected problem of mine since I havent had a good solution for it. The problem is that both are materials. I dont have any free and good brick textures to use. If I had I guess I could decal the walls instead and paint a transition. Anyway, thanks again for your comments

martin

Feb 8 2007, 04:41 PM

Stian, you can turn any material into a map by "flattening" the model (part of model) in an Action, rendering at whatever resolution you want, then decaling the rendered image onto the flattened model. (Remember to save the flattened Action so you can do it again if you want to.)

agep

Feb 12 2007, 06:21 AM

QUOTE(martin @ Feb 9 2007, 01:41 AM)

I tried that, but I keep getting exception #10 and render quit right after pass 1... I think the required resolution is just to much for the computer or something?

btw, what is causing the render artifact in Woots dress?

anyway, here is a new bundle of lit scenes (first post is updated):

2_07_074
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2_07_075
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2_07_076
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martin

Feb 12 2007, 06:29 AM

QUOTE(agep @ Feb 12 2007, 06:21 AM)

QUOTE(martin @ Feb 9 2007, 01:41 AM)

I tried that, but I keep getting exception #10 and render quit right after pass 1... I think the required resolution is just to much for the computer or something?

What resolution?

QUOTE

2_07_076
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Is Woot's shirt glowing like that in this shot repeatable? (We can't get it to happen but we see it occassionally.)

agep

Feb 12 2007, 06:38 AM

QUOTE(martin @ Feb 12 2007, 03:29 PM)

What resolution?

I made a projectfile containing only the wall I want to render. The last test I did was at 6400x2400

QUOTE(martin @ Feb 12 2007, 03:29 PM)

Is Woot's shirt glowing like that in this shot repeatable? (We can't get it to happen but we see it occassionally.)

yes

I've attached the projectfile in case someone wants to try to render it. I tried to render from objects mode (with zoom set to 50, final render with 16 multipass, 6400x2400)

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Paul Forwood

Feb 12 2007, 06:40 AM

I have had this strange anomaly with Woot's shirt and I found that it goes away when the project is reloaded.
Have you shut down or tried reloading the project since you rendered these images, Stian?

agep

Feb 12 2007, 09:10 AM

QUOTE(Paul Forwood @ Feb 12 2007, 03:40 PM)

I have had this strange anomaly with Woot's shirt and I found that it goes away when the project is reloaded.
Have you shut down or tried reloading the project since you rendered these images, Stian?

I tried to restart A:M and reload the project, but still get the glowing. I does look like the glowing comes on the last pass (on a 9 multipass render)

Noel

Feb 12 2007, 10:02 AM

QUOTE(agep @ Feb 12 2007, 09:10 AM)

QUOTE(Paul Forwood @ Feb 12 2007, 03:40 PM)

I have had this strange anomaly with Woot's shirt and I found that it goes away when the project is reloaded.
Have you shut down or tried reloading the project since you rendered these images, Stian?

I tried to restart A:M and reload the project, but still get the glowing. I does look like the glowing comes on the last pass (on a 9 multipass render)

Stian could you make up an am report for this please. http://www.hash.com/reports
Which scene? (it looks like 2_07_076)
Which frame(s)?
What render settings?

Thanks

agep

Feb 12 2007, 02:36 PM

QUOTE(Noel @ Feb 12 2007, 07:02 PM)

Stian could you make up an am report for this please. http://www.hash.com/reports
Which scene? (it looks like 2_07_076)
Which frame(s)?
What render settings?

Thanks

Done

mtpeak2

Feb 12 2007, 02:44 PM

I believe this is a shader problem, there is an oren nayar shader set on his shirt. Try setting it to none and rerender, Stian.

Noel

Feb 13 2007, 11:03 AM

QUOTE(mtpeak2 @ Feb 12 2007, 02:44 PM)

I believe this is a shader problem, there is an oren nayar shader set on his shirt. Try setting it to none and rerender, Stian.

I removed oren nayar from the latest woot, to test just this. I rendered stians example now with out that, and with it, and it sure seems like it is caused by that shader. Now I need to get to render much faster and still repeat so that I can debug this in a decent amount of time.

Thanks for the clues, and repeatable test case!

agep

Feb 15 2007, 03:45 AM

Here are some more scenes. I'm going home today, attending my grandma's 75th birthday. I'll be away till over the weekend.

(First post is updated)
2_07_072
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2_07_073
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2_07_086
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2_07_087
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racreel

Feb 20 2007, 07:40 AM

I don't see any lightning!

I thought this was an FX shot.

Seriously, I think the lighting looks great!

agep

Feb 25 2007, 04:06 AM

yet another bundle with renders. I had a few problems on two of them, so it took me some time to do them. 2_07_069 would not let me render the hair (got an render quit). First post is updated

2_07_066
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2_07_067
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2_07_068
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2_07_069
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2_07_070
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2_07_071
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KenH

Feb 25 2007, 05:35 AM

They look great! The first image in the second batch seems brighter than the rest. Have you put in the props like the balloon ship or my Tinman yet? I can put him in but I don't want to get conflicts.

martin

Feb 25 2007, 07:01 AM

QUOTE(KenH @ Feb 25 2007, 05:35 AM)

Watch out for props (i.e. Torsten's Airship) that are simple set "active = OFF". They might be in the scene - just not visible during testing. Ken, your Tinman hasn't been added yet, as far as I know. When Stian says it's okay, do it.

agep

Feb 25 2007, 07:11 AM

I have not imported the ship into all the scenes since it is not in the cameraview all the time. However where required it is added (see scene 2_07_080, 83 and 84). What is the new tinman? is it going to be a seamless transition?

KenH

Feb 25 2007, 07:31 AM

Remember this guy? He could be sitting in a corner or something to add to the clutter. You can find him here if you want to put him in:

data\Shared Data\Models\Set_chors\Ouside_Ku-Klip_Final_Set_Mark\Sculptures

agep

Feb 25 2007, 07:35 AM

Haha, brilliant. I'll try to find a suitable place for him. Let me know if you already have a place for him to rest. Perhaps we should detach a few of his body parts? just so he doesn't look to much alive?

KenH

Feb 25 2007, 07:38 AM

Go for it. Do what you like with him. Just do it with a copy in the workshop folder. Cheers.

agep

Feb 28 2007, 03:23 AM

Here is a new bundle of lit scenes. I have done some minor rearrangement of the clutter (not yet found a place for Kens tinman:( ). What I did was that I moved the steambike and the oxytank from the mezzanine. So some of the first post images does not contain them (a few are updated though).
first post is updated

2_07_059
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2_07_060
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2_07_063
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2_07_064
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2_07_093
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KenH

Feb 28 2007, 03:48 AM

Nice! The second last image could use some more clutter under the platform...

What is Klip's beard doing for the render times?

agep

Mar 4 2007, 10:36 AM

QUOTE(KenH @ Feb 28 2007, 12:48 PM)

What is Klip's beard doing for the render times?

almost doubles the rendertime.

New stack of render:

2_07_053
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2_07_054
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2_07_094
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2_07_096
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2_07_097
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agep

Mar 4 2007, 10:42 AM

oh, I almost forgot

I had this scene rendered out just as a test. I think it looks nice, there is a problem with scarecrows belt though

Click to view attachment

Animus

Mar 4 2007, 11:42 AM

Nice work Stian, your lighting gives a good mood to the workshop. And thanks, it's nice to see a scene I animated with your beautiful workshop fully rendered.

Michel

Zaryin

Mar 4 2007, 12:30 PM

I think the lighting looks great so far. Are you going to have any spotlights on the characters alone? You know, that follow them through the scene?

mtpeak2

Mar 4 2007, 07:42 PM

As for the belt, I took a look at the settings and the enforcement was set at frame 100 (defeats the purpose of the 100 frame advancement for the start of the animation). This needs to be changed and set on frame 0 instead (the 100 frames are a preroll for dynamics). Also noticed the enforcement was set to 20%, this means nothing, it's the same as if it was set to 100%. I was going to change the enforcement to an on/off pose, since a percentage didn't effect the dynamics, but forgot about it.

Great shots, by the way.

agep

Mar 6 2007, 12:21 PM

Thanks Mark

Looks like there has been some changes to Ku-Klip? He looks much better now, not so specular, and his beard isn't pure white. Great

Here is the latest renders (first post is updated also), I know KK beard went a little crazy in 099:

2_07_098
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2_07_099
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2_07_100
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2_07_103
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agep

Mar 16 2007, 09:44 AM

Here is a new stack of renders. It took some time to get these ready due to some problems with particles and volumetric. Let me know what you think. The first post is updated in case someone wants to see all the renders of the workshop done so far

Best regards
Stian

2_07_043
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2_07_044
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2_07_045
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2_07_046
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2_07_047
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2_07_048
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2_07_049
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2_07_050
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2_07_052
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2_07_104
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KenH

Mar 16 2007, 10:07 AM

In the second one, TW is really bright while the other two blend into the background. I'm not sure what can be done. The others seem fine if a little too "clean" looking. Maybe some fog would help that.

agep

Mar 16 2007, 10:20 AM

QUOTE(KenH @ Mar 16 2007, 07:07 PM)

In the second one, TW is really bright while the other two blend into the background. I'm not sure what can be done

Thanks Ken. Its probably just a lightlist I've set to bright. I'll fix it

agep

Mar 24 2007, 04:47 AM

New renders
first post is updated

2_07_020
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2_07_021
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2_07_035
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2_07_036
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2_07_037
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2_07_038
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2_07_039
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alweb

Mar 26 2007, 06:48 PM

Wow!
very nice ! all those pictures are great !
congratulation!

agep

Apr 10 2007, 11:07 AM

Thanks Al

Here comes a new set of images. Not so many this time, because I did post a few directly into the first post right before easter, and I also have been busy updating the workshop (drive gear animation and various clutter addition). I added allot of clutter at the entrance hall because that part was very clean and naked before, I like a lot better now.

2_07_012
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2_07_013b
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2_07_051
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2_07_055a
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2_07_056
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agep

Apr 15 2007, 04:01 PM

Here are 3 more renders. I've also been working on reducing the rendertimes for the workshop by converting some of the materials/darktrees into decals, and I've been able to take of several minutes of rendering on each pass

2_07_090
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2_07_091
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2_07_095
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Rodney

Apr 15 2007, 05:25 PM

...and here I thought you were just an extreme modeler Stian.

You've got an intesting look going on here.
Somewhere between claymation and old film.

I'd love to know what you've been studying as your lighting has a definite stage lighting effect.
This as opposed to the standard CG lighting fare.

I like.

Dhar

Apr 15 2007, 06:02 PM

I'm a big proponent of decals. That still looks fantastic. But what happened to KK's beard? It looks like a straw broom

agep

Apr 18 2007, 08:45 AM

Thanks guys

Actually, I wish I had the time to do a deep light study, because my understanding of lighting is limited.

note: If someone got any good tileable rock/stone textures (for the mountain side), let me know, because I plan of changing the material that are in use now. I don't like it, and I would also be able to lower the rendertime if I change to decals

New renders:
2_07_034
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2_07_040
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2_07_042
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2_07_092
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agep

Apr 21 2007, 07:40 AM

a few more

the first post in this thread is updated

2_07_041
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2_07_057
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2_07_058
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agep

Apr 24 2007, 12:55 PM

New bundle. First post updated... hmmm, there is a few attachments on the first post now I must say

I'm having a problem with Ku-Klips beard. In some scenes it renders white (shaders are turned on). I've registered the problem on A:M reports

2_07_054a
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2_07_055
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2_07_061
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2_07_101
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2_07_102
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KenH

Apr 24 2007, 02:19 PM

Very nice. Keep it up! In the second image (last post) the area to the right beside the rock wall seems a little bare.

agep

Apr 29 2007, 09:57 AM

New renders. first post updated

2_07_006
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2_07_007b
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2_07_008
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2_07_009
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2_07_010
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2_07_011b
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2_07_017
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ypoissant

Apr 29 2007, 10:12 AM

Wow! Stian. your lighting kills are improving incredibly.

I got to get those black spots.

KenH

Apr 29 2007, 10:34 AM

Yeah, they're steadily getting better. The characters are clear from the backgrounds. Do you use rim lights? What version are you using now?

agep

Apr 29 2007, 10:51 AM

Thanks Yves and Ken. Yes I use Rim lights. I also use light lists. I'm currently working in V13 since the Volumetrics are broken in the current V14 beta

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