Here's my bouncing ball exercise... if it's good enough I'll just do my final now.

I think I'm in the intermediate zone already, I just need confirmation...

Number two... the two dropped balls of different mass/material...

Let me know what you think... Thanks!

Very nice just try and give your ball that doesent bounce as much.....i noticed it didnt have any squash and stretch...and if it bounces even once then its going to have some squash and stretch....but really good job on timing!

The first movie should be called breast implants gone wild.

Seriously, in the second clip, the timing on the first ball seems a little odd. What I mean - the ball starts off just fine, but then as it gets to the end of the bouncing, it seems to speed up, kinda like gravity is increasing exponentially as it gets closer to the ground. I might be way off base though.

You know what, I should just shut up, cause I haven't even done that excercise yet

Overall, I think it's very good.

The loop in the first clip looks pretty good. Nice squash/stretch transition.

The ball on the left, in the second movie, lacks the stretch just before it hits the ground and just before it leaves the ground. I agree on the end of the bounces, it's an arcs issue that I myself struggle with. It'd be a good practice to watch or film a bouncing ball to get the feel of the bounce timing right.

All in all, a very good start

Yeah, now that I hear that I've probably been trying to do more of a physics simulation than traditional cartoon type animation on the second exercise.

I had time on the train (BART) on the way to work to tweak it and I think it's better... please give me your critiques.

Thanks in advance.

Well i dont have Dhar's super vison...but from my point of view, one word, "Flawless" Exelent job i cant find anything wrong.

Much better. Almost there - my only critique is the beginning of the fall, both balls fall at a constant velocity which make it seem unrealistic. The balls must have acceleration as they fall.



Thanks to Robcat, Alonso, Pixar, forevernameless, Mark and everybody who critiques my work, they all helped me develop my critical eye for details. All of you will have it soon. I am a much better animator now than few weeks ago and I haven't even scratched the surface yet

The only reason both fall at the same time is that they were both dropped at the same time and 'theoretically' they should both accelerate at the same speed, regardless of mass or material.

Wind resistance would be the only factor and with two round objects the same size and shape, I would think that would be negligable.

I do believe they are falling a bit too slow in the beginning... maybe I'll tweak that again... been really busy at work here.

I know what you're saying Jody & I agree with you, that's why I said it "seem" unrealistic. The problem with animated pictures is that the more you apply realistic physics to them the less realistic (un-interesting, lifeless) they'll appear. That's why we add & exaggerate stretch & squash to balls because only then will they "seem" believable! We're fooling the eye into believing that what it's seeing is real by adding unrealistic details.

I highly recommend Walt Disney's book "The illusion of life". It is a must for every animator at any level. Although I've read it cover to cover, I keep finding things in it that I swore I didn't read before. It's a valuable reference book.

Opps i didnt get that one i got the "Animators Survival Kit" Is that one still ok....it should be arriving sometime on tuesday.

I think there was something nagging at me too about the begining of the animation.

I've dropped them from a higher height and now the speed coming down looks more correct to me... correct me if I'm wrong.

I love 10 second tweaks!

Thanks again to you Dhar and everyone else that's critiquing my work... I know I need all the help I can get.

I will try and pick that book up, I don't have that one in particular.

I have to stop critique before I look further down the post anyways look at the picture it is probably already out of date but this helps point out stuff

I'm feeling clueless... does my stretch not do what you have marked? Please elaborate PF_Mark...

I have that as well and it is good too, in fact the author even refers to some of the authors of "The Illusion of Life". I think many of the exercises here are based on the 'Survival' book.

Robcat & Pixar have some exellent recommendations, send them a message to give you their list of top ten books.

yeah ok.

sorry I had to leave mid post and did not have time to finish or explain better. When I looked at the exe. that I made the picture for the ball is falling it is stretching which is good put the frame before it hits the ball is stretched which is good then the next frame the ball fits and is round which is wrong IMHO it should hit stretched then the next frame is round. scrub through it and you see the ball changes shape in mid air when you get the animators survival kit there are examples and when you see it it will all be clear. That is an great book and Robocat recomended it and it is full of examples that will open your eyes to how this should be done.

Keep in mind I am learning also just trying to spread the knowledge others have taught me

Now on to the next subject acceleration and deceleration look at the line I there is no accel in the fall the ball should start sslowing from the top accel but not decel (watch the spline in the bounce default will make ball slow before hitting ground) then I think fast up with stretch and some accel but not as much as down then slow with gravity and shape back to round.

PF_Mark,

The ball intentionally squishes slow and stretches slow... it's supposed to be bouncing on it's own accord (alive). That was the reason the in between shows the ball seemingly unsquished/unstreched. Does it seem that wrong looking at the motion in realtime as opposed to frame-by-frame?

Got my next one done... two ball bounce...

Please review... thanks in advance folks!

Exellent job! Only critiq is you got the same problem as rossk, the ball needs to hit the ground while in a stretch, cahnge into a squish while still on the ground, and change back into a stretch while on the ground, then it can start moving again.

My problem with accomplishing the ball being on the surface long enough to do a stretch-to-squish-to-stretch motion is that it's moving too fast in my animation and it feels wrong for me to slow it down more.

Am I doing something inherently wrong here? I dunno, motion with real objects is so fast. If I increase the number of frames, it starts to look like slow motion to me.

Any ideas?

What you do is on your frame where the ball is one frame away from hitting the ground instead of letting it sit there just move the ball to the ground.
The first pic is the wrong way the second pic is the right way, see the first pic...the ball is still above the ground, the way you can fix it withought ruining your speed is on the same frame your ball is above the ground(as shown) Instead move it to the floor...hope this made sence.

Makes perfect sense Robert... here's the rub. My animation is moving fast enough that there is only ONE frame where the ball actually touches the ground or the wall.

So I did what I could to make the stretch work by leaving it stretched up until the frame before and squishing it on the frame it hits and finally stretching it the frame after it hits.

Again, the motion is too fast. If I hold the ball at that location longer it looks very odd.

Only other solution that I can think of would be for me to go to a 60 fps animation.

hmmm....this is a problem....

Th initial fly-in of each ball is rather linear and evenly spaced. Not characteristic fo a falling object.

The arcs after they hit the wall are much better, although i still feel like the spacing going up and down is too even in many spots.

I think you should try to put in that contact stretch before the squash; it will help make the squash less of a "pop" and make the contact with the ground more obvious. I don't thinkit will look too sticky.

But good work overall!

Damn you and your forensic animation examination robcat!!!


It seemed I could do that on the first bounce of the red and white ball, but I had to go with a compromise on the blue and white one, when I did full contact for three frames it looked like it some stickytape or something... just felt wrong.

I'm still not sure it's quite there on the blue and white ball, but the other looks way better now.

Thanks robcat!

Also, here is my initial tailball drop... not quite happy with the tail. I suck at things dynamic chains should take care of...

Threee frames woudl probably be too many... I'm just talking two. Stretched contact, then squash... then next frame is already off the ground.

But the balls are overlapping so much on the screen it's hard to assess visually, If you're determined to have both balls in there,, delay one by a second or so.

Here you go robcat... should be easier to disect now...

Thats awsome.

Another tail animation for everyone to analyse...

Thanks in advance.

Looks good....I think theres something happening there on frame 15 with the tail that just doesent look right.

How did I miss this thread?

You've got some great work here Jody, I just have time to comment on your last one.

It looks really nice, I like the overall timing of the piece. What I think you could work is pushing/exaggerating the poses. I have the word 'intentionality' stuck in my head from last month's Keith Lango Video Tutorials, and I think you could use it here. Really squash that ball down, aim him towards his target, and exaggerate the jumping. Since this ball is 'alive' (not realistic like a regular ball drop) make him really seem conscious: "I am a ball, and I'm going over to the other side of the screen, watch me". I say this because right now he seems 'floaty', or lacking intention (there's that word again). I'm just babbling, maybe that's how you want it. But if you 'push it' too much, you can always tone it back down.

The tail's looking very good! I think you could loosen up the second joint a little.

Again great work on this thread! I look forward to seeing more from you!

Hope that helps, and please remember that I have no idea what I'm talking about,
-Josh

Well, now I feel I need to revisit the definitions of the 'alive' and 'not alive' ball.

I was actually trying for the 'not alive' ball in the last one... I'll have to go over it again.

Anyone care to elaborate on the differences of the 'alive' vs. 'not alive' ball?

I was wanting the 'not alive' ball to have some squish/stretch to it, but maybe I was wrong...

Looks pretty good to me... I'm probably going to use this along with some others for analyzing for when I do the tail-ball animation.
Nice job!

On your previous animation of the 2 balls falling and hitting the wall, I would recommend bumping up the acceleration due to gravity a smidgen. Otherwise those both look good.

Basically if something's not alive only natural forces are acting on it (gravity, friction). If something's alive if has control over itself (direction, emotion, etc.) and it's doing it all for a particular reason. But if you really want to learn about toon vs. realistic download Keith Lango's latest VTS video: http://www.keithlango.com/

Okay... here's my two alive balls...

It's not completed yet... just the beginning

Haha...cute Big beachball mentoring little beachball. Original idea.

A little enhancement for the big ball is to have it tilt back just before it proceeds to stop (anticipation). Sorta like putting on the breaks.

Come to think of it, the jumping should also have a little tilt forward in order to push the ball in that direction but keep the landing straight down since they're pretty fast successive jumps.

Good to see you here again.

Dahr,

Yeah, it's there, it's just was a really small angle. I doubled it and I think it looks better now.

I got the full length done...

What do you think? Critiques on the animation are welcome!

Much, much better.

The stopping of big ball could use more of a back angle, especially the second bounce. And then have some follow thru after the stop (angle it in the opposite direction then back to rest), ya know? anticipation vs follow thru?

Okay, I tweaked a lot of little stuff this time... let me know if it's 'good enough'... I'm eager to get my final done for level one bootcamp...

I'd love to hear from robcat on this one... (TEAR IT UP BUDDY! )

I have started on the final for level one of the bootcamp... see what you think...

Well, ok...

The interaction between the balls is working well and the Squetch is handled appropriately.

However one important fundamental has gone MIA here: arcs and spacing. (I guess that's two)

Even though this is a "jumping" ball all the physics of a ball bouncing thru the air still apply. So you still need to check that your arcs are really arcs and don't have flat sides. And you still need to make sure that when the ball is going up it's slowing down (not traveling at a steady pace) and that when it's going down it's picking up speed (again, not going at a steady pace).

Even a few frames of steady linear motion will make a bounce look floaty. The actual difference in pixels of screen space between what you have and really correct arcs and spacing won't be very much, but it makes a big difference in the way the animation feels as we watch it.

A:M's onion skin feature is a quick way to show multiple fames at once onthe screen and is great for checking arcs and spacing.

Wow... thanks robcat... and I thought I was done...

That's okay, now I can apply the arc changes to my final as well... I'll have to repost that, but evaluate the rest of it to your heart's content.

Here's my modified arcs ...

THat is a really good one MMZ! When i looked at it i was wondering the beggining bounces...they all seemed to be just a little lower than the other..but on the 4th bounce it suddenly lost its power and bounced less half of what the 3rd bounce was. i just thought it was strange how that happend

Your final level one looks good. The big ball bounce looks great. The little guy looks pretty good, but his movement might be a little slow and floaty. I like his tail action, especially the little wag...cute!

Paula

Thanks again robcat! Here is the updated 'Two Alive ball bounce' with robcat's changes implemented (properly I hope!)

[attachmentid=14891]

Thanks Robert, not quite sure what you mean, could you explain? (Refer to which animation please)

Paula, thanks so much, I will probably be altering the final with the changes robcat noted in my arcs. Also, I was thinking of making the 'dog' ball bounce around the 'master' ball when he stops instead of just bouncing in front of him.

It may be some time before I get back to this thread though, I have a Tinman's Castle to finish!