Hi Guys!

I have a bit confusion in my head about actions vs chor actions.
So, I would like to ask anybody help me to define usage of these actions.

Which and When do you use actions and the chor action?
What is the different between actions and chor action?

Please write or post some different examples!

I want to make music clip animation,but I don't know, how can I begin it!

Please write your ideas or your advice!

Best regards,

Sharky

There are no hard and fast rules, but generally you use actions for any movement you want to be able to repeat, or which you are likely to want to use elsewhere.

For example, if your music video shows someone dancing, you can define an action for one dance step. Drag and drop that action onto your character in your choreography, set the action's repeat count to the number of steps you want, and voila! one dancing dancer. You can save that action to a separate file, so you can import it into other projects.

Now, suppose your dancer's legs are too close together while performing those repeating dance steps. In the choreography you can simply move the feet further apart at the start of the dance, and that additional offset will be added to the dance step action.

This sounds like a trivial explanation, but there's a lot of power in it - you can overlay actions upon actions, both separate savable actions and choreography actions. And there's more. Actions needn't necessarily have to include movement - I use them to construct complex characters from a set of separate parts (using "action objects").

Sharky (good to see you by the way)

Stuart really answered this already but since I'm here saying 'Hi'...

The general rule is:
Use regular actions for when you want to cycle or reuse any action.
Use choreography actions to add to those actions or adjust things to taste.

Both the online help files and the manual have some things to say about where to use each.

(Don't be such a stranger!)
Rodney

Although "actions" are reusable, it's very difficult to to make ones that look good from every angle.

The angle that counts is the one that the camera sees, so most non-game animation is done in the chor without "actions". This is the easiest way to craft the motion and poses so that they look good to the camera.

Not my complete answer but something I'd like to add:

When I have complex set, meaning there's quite a few actors/props involved, I tend to animate mostly in the chor. The interaction of camera angles, lights, actors with objects, actors with each other almost demands it. Action objects have certain qualities that make using them problematic under certain situations. They are helpful- don't get me wrong, but not a panacea.

Anyway, when there's a clearly cyclical action or a self-interacting action (like a character scratching his own butt, or holding his own chin to think) then an action action is often easier and the reusability of it makes it powerful.

I guess my process is:
Some actions are *obviously* destined to be done as action-actions: walk cycles (there are exceptions here, though), certain dance moves, etc.

Then I animate in the chor for everything else, but I'm mindful of what I'm doing and I think: "should this be brought out of the chor and done as an a-action? Could I reuse this? Would any inter-character interaction be lost or made more difficult if I bring it out to an a-action?" Etc...

IMO, stuart nailed it with: 'there's no hard and fast rules."

And to add to what Robcat mentioned: I often find that animating in chor with a known camera angle allows me to cheat the animation in such a way that I only have to animate what is seen- I'd be wasting time in an a-action animating something completely and neatly...

Rob,
Do you mostly try to stay away from cyclic actions? I assume a 'Yes' answer here but want to make sure.
You remind me that with the introduction of Expressions there are a lot of cyclic actions that can be carried out in the Choreography nowadays. I guess I'm mostly thinking of actions like rotating wheels, windmills, helicopter blades, etc.

Rodney

I tend to animate in the choreography too. My use of action objects, especially recently, are for mechanical nurnies - the little details to flesh out an object. For example, I'm currently working on a robot character with pistons and pipes all over the place. Rather than model a zillion pipes and pistons, I've simply modelled one or two pose-modifiable versions of each which I attach to the robot superstructure as action objects. There's an added benefit - I can animate a simple core robot character, then when I'm happy with that I simply drop the actions with the nurnies on to the robot for the final render. This way I can have a fairly clean chor window while I animate, and drop the detail on with a few actions. I realise I could substitute a more detailed robot, but this way I only have one robot to maintain.

I think I'm straying away from the original question...

Aside from walks, truly cyclic motions seem to be rather rare in character animation. And the best practice now seems to be to animate the steps individually rather than repeat a pre-animated cycle.
I suppose with the spline extrapolation that's possible in the timeline you wouldn't even need expressions.
These are such geometrically simple motions that they don't really have a "best" angle for the camera so actions will work well for them.

I think we could make good use of character actions in TWO for crowd scenes where people are "idling" but can't all be idling in the same way at the same time. We could mix and match different idles until we got the right appearance.

Hi Guys!

First of all, I want to thank your fast and useful answers!!!

I see that you use chor actions primary, and then you achive the little details and secondary motions with actions. (for example: cycle and reusable action) Of course, it has been exceptions too. (walk cycle)

But,
I have some troublesome things with the combine of actions for me.
This problems are how can I combine any actions with any other actions in the choreography, so the transition stay exact and stay realistic(for example:speed,time,place)

Because I visited more site of A:M users and I viewed her/his/your animations, and I saw lot of cool short movies and scenes. But I don't know, how could you do these, suchlike realistic and imperfective?
For example: Robert

Best regards,

Sharky

It is difficult to make actions that have been animated separately fit together.

I know it is tempting to try to reuse animation that has already been done. But for the best effect it's easier to make each shot one continuous piece of animation. Most shots are only a few seconds long so it's really not that big a deal.

You plot out your basic poses that tell the story, then you animate the character to get from one pose to the next. The clip of mine that you linked to above is all animated in the Chor with no "actions". It has about 5 main poses to it. The walk "cycle" is not really a cycle, it was keyframed as a series of separate steps.

And realism? That will come with practice and observation of good reference.

Robert,
I liked the example that you posted. I have been trying to learn to animate solely in the choreography, so your example is useful. Can you describe what the 5 main poses were in that animation? That would help me get a feel for the pose to pose methodology

Thanks,

Scott

I've over-simplified it. But my clip was from an assignment for AnimationMentor. We had to take our character through 4 emotions: relaxed, alert, engaged, disgusted.

You can see the original four poses in the attached clip.

-The walk is "relaxed" (not very good, this one got changed early)
-when he lifts the lid he is "alert" (later I rolled this into "engaged" and made the end of the walk be "alert")
-when he tastes it he is "engaged"
-then he is "disgusted"

-later I added "dead" when my mentor suggested it needed a conclusion of some sort.

There's still lots of work to do to get between those four states. I acted it out and watched myself in a mirror and tried to become aware of how my body was moving. Some parts I just had to do from imagination. There are lots of additional poses around the main poses that help bring it to life.

Of course, this wasn't my first animation. I did many shorter, smaller animations before I got where I could put even this 20 second shot together.

And apologies to all for writing this in a forum about reusable actions!

Robert,
Thanks for providing that. I love the last pose! I see the technique better now. I'll take the blame for hijacking the thread. If you care to take this elsewhere, perhaps you could put this in the Tutorial section and add a post or two about how you then took tyhe 4 poses and did the animating (maybe with two poses?)

Even if you don't, I think I can learn a lot from what you've provided!

Scott

Hi Rob!

First of all, I want to thank your short descriptions!!!
And I agree with Scott opinion:


I have begun to understand the progress of animation in chor,so I would like to ask from you, please you continue this "Tute",because I have seen with pleasure,that other A:M users are interesting in this topic!It should talk in depth!

And, I just can repeat Scott's words,but I don't do that !:D
So, please write us, how can you do the tying between the four main poses? Because I would like to see through all of this method. Especially, I take an interest in :


What do you think, that we should talk about this theme in depht?


Can you post some good chor references or project file?

Of course, I will wait any opinion or idea from anybody about, how can I combine any actions with any other actions in the choreography, so the transition stay exact and stay realistic(for example:speed,time,place)?

Yours sincerely,

Sharky

Rob,
This is a perfect place to post the info. Not that a tutorial wouldn't be appreciated in the Tutorials Forum of course.

We've got to know when and when not to use and reuse actions. Here is about the best place you could put that information.

Thanks for your fine explination.

In another post I linked to some online information by George Maestri.
In it he wrote the following which I find to be quite useful.



**Exercise omitted.
Rodney

Knowing what to do between the poses is a huge topic. It's where 90% of the time goes. I'm not sure how to write a tut on it. But I think the key is analysis. Act it out. Watch someone do it. Figure out what has to happen to get from A to B. And then analyse the action from B to C... and so on. The mainposes are a way of dividing the action into smaller episodes and serve as key points of interest where the audience can get a good look at the character and see what he is thinking.

It also helps to start small. Do very brief animations first, and get feedback on those. Problems are usually just as obvious in a 2 second clip as in a 20 second clip, but they are much easier to comment on.
Richard Williams' book "Animator's Survival Kit" teaches walks this way. (This is also the way Animation Mentor teaches it). First he places all the contact poses (where the heel is hitting the ground) for every step the character takes. Then he goes back and does the passing poses in between those... You can see the whole thing in his book. Get it!

By "reference" I mean real-life examples. video of someone doing the action so you can frame thru it and analyze what's going on, or even easier... act the motion out yourself and pay attention to how things happen. It takes practice to become observant.

Hi!

I thank your descriptons about your method and technics!
It will be very useful stuff for A:M users!

Thanks, Rob!

Yours sincerely,

Sharky

wow guys you are great ( group hug )...you guys are talking about, exactly what i need to hear.

i'm just finished a character ( modeled and rigged ) and i have a idea for a short movie.

and i was wonder where do i start ...actions and chor actions

please tell me you guys continue this line of talk somewhere else ...

i did the 80% of the tut from the manual ...but i guess i could try my character through the same tut's

oh btw Rob you talked about the Animator Mentor ...how far are you into it? ...is it a time time hog? ( i just ask because i work 40 hours a week ..not in the arts world and sometimes it's hard to shift gears)

sorry this reply is not very inforative

thanks

Steve

( just a little squirrel looking for a nut of wisdom )

Here's a reply I wrote to a similar Q a while back

http://www.hash.com/forums/index.php?s=&sh...ndpost&p=117244

My only edits would be that I'm now starting the 4th quarter, and that I definitely feel you will need to clear about 20 hours per week to do the assignments well. And you want to do it well since it would be a waste of money otherwise.

My only edits would be that I'm now starting the 4th quarter, and that I definitely feel you will need to clear about 20 hours per week to do the assignments well. And you want to do it well since it would be a waste of money otherwise.



4th quarter ..Cool ( i use Cool because i'm old ( 37 lol ) )


good luck Rob

Steve

I know I'm fairly new, but I would like to add a point that could save some serious headaches for new users.

When adding slight variations and nuances to the character during an "action" cylce in the chor, be sure to pay attention to the blend mode setting. If your "chor action" is set to "replace" (the default, I think) then the bone keyed will completely override the bone's keyframe from the "action" action during the entire time that bone has keyframes associated with it in the "chor" action. This is especially true if you want to tweak a foot using a "chor" action during a walk cycle. Suddenly the character seems to hop afterwards instead of walk. This caused me a LOT of confusion and frustration in the beginning as well it did for a lot of other newbies. It made me really afraid of using multifple chor actions and "action" cycles and such.

I usually use a blend mode of "replace" when I am not overlapping that chor action with any others higher up in the action hierarchy or if I am keying bones that are not keyed higher up.

Now (finally) I think I understand it all better and am starting to take advantage of breaking my animations into smaller chor actions, which also helps to adjust the sequencing if something appears too fast or slow.